FOT Forum
The Best Show on WFMU => Show Discussion => Topic started by: JP on July 29, 2006, 01:27:46 AM
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The days before the Kevin Smith best show I had been going through all sorts of kevin smith material online and I just couldn't believe it. Of course, I had already been steered by tom but it is great to just immerse yourself in something that you just cant stand. I've not seen any of the films for a variety of reasons. Tom's rant was so great and was the release I was hoping to hear.
Anyway B Buster you are all our hero!
jp
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Thanks, JP. I wish I could provide some links to those ancient debates, but, alas, they are no more. I do remember my opening salvo though. I paraphrased Steinbeck's "The Grapes of Wrath":
Wherever there are people celebrating the overrated movies of Kevin Smith and Quentin Tarantino [I lumped the two together at the time--still do], I'll be there [busting balls]. Wherever there are people over the age of 14 reading comic books, I'll be there. Wherever there are grown men playing with toys (or "collectibles" as they call them to avoid embarrassment), I'll be there.
You can only imagine the sort of hornet's nest this stirred up among the nerds on View Askew. Ah, but it was fun.
Well, I saw Clerks II today (I couldn't resist after Tom's terrific rant). All I can say is that Tom went easy on that movie. He should have condemned it for the full 3 hours. Man, I was literally stunned by how bad it is. I mean, Tom didn't even mention Kevin Smith copping a scene from The Drew Carey Show of all things, adding a scene that has no bearing whatsoever on the "plot" just so he can put his kid in the movie, and how 'bout Rosario Dawson pronouncing two "s" sounds for the possessive of "parents'" (I know this sounds trivial, but it irritated the hell out of me)? Ugh. Then there's Smith's weird religious preoccupations. Remember the religious nuts who used to show up at sporting events with their "John 3:16" signs? Well, Smith seems to have found the equivalent in the jail scene toward the end of the movie. Then there's the borrowed bad bestiality joke from "Bachelor Party." It wasn't funny then and it sure as hell isn't funny now, but that didn't stop Smith from using it again for his big finale (I'm always shocked after seeing a Kevin Smith movie that some adult didn't intervene to tell him that his script is horrible, but at this point I think he's viewed as a brand or a franchise that no one can mess with). And I was wrong about some hidden "laughs" after the credits. All there was was a huge list of names of people who had signed up to Smith's myspace account (I was reminded of The Jerk when Steve Martin discovers that his name has been "published" in the phone book). I can just picture all the slack-jawed Smith acolytes sitting riveted in their seats waiting to see their name on the "big screen." As Tom said, there doesn't seem to be a bottom for Smith, he just keeps going lower and lower.
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And I was wrong about some hidden "laughs" after the credits. All there was was a huge list of names of people who had signed up to Smith's myspace account
I hear Bill Zebub is actually planning to do this in the middle of his next film.
Oh, and as a witness to some of these flare ups between B. Buster and Smith fans, I can confirm they could be quite amusing. I feel like my message board life has come full circle now. This is quite a moment. :'(
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Tried http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.viewaskew.com (http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.viewaskew.com) ?
I don't know when you used to post on the board.
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Bump.
Check out B.Buster's entry:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?page=2&term=jay+and+silent+bob (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?page=2&term=jay+and+silent+bob)
Nevermind. I thought Mike was busting Kevin Smith's balls with the entry. He is not.
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Bump.
Check out B.Buster's entry:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?page=2&term=jay+and+silent+bob (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?page=2&term=jay+and+silent+bob)
That is comedy gold. Clown shoes? ;D
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"Wherever there are people over the age of 14 reading comic books, I'll be there."
You're kidding, right?
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Jay and Silent Bob are terrible, one-note jokes that only stoners laugh at. They're fucking clown shoes. If they were real, I'd beat the shit out of them for being so stupid. I can't believe Miramax would have anything to do with this shit.
I, for one, will be boycotting this movie. Who's with me?
by B. Buster Sep 13, 2004 share this
If my memory serves correctly, didn't this make it into Jay and Silent Bob strike back? Mike, shouldn't you be getting a movie check?
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"Wherever there are people over the age of 14 reading comic books, I'll be there."
You're kidding, right?
No. I take a hard line when it comes to comics. I realize it's a sore point with some people.
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Jay and Silent Bob are terrible, one-note jokes that only stoners laugh at. They're fucking clown shoes. If they were real, I'd beat the shit out of them for being so stupid. I can't believe Miramax would have anything to do with this shit.
I, for one, will be boycotting this movie. Who's with me?
by B. Buster Sep 13, 2004 share this
If my memory serves correctly, didn't this make it into Jay and Silent Bob strike back? Mike, shouldn't you be getting a movie check?
What's up on Urban Dictionary is taken from Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back. I didn't write it.
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You "take a hard line?" Seriously?
Just live and let live.
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Jay and Silent Bob are terrible, one-note jokes that only stoners laugh at. They're fucking clown shoes. If they were real, I'd beat the shit out of them for being so stupid. I can't believe Miramax would have anything to do with this shit.
I, for one, will be boycotting this movie. Who's with me?
by B. Buster Sep 13, 2004 share this
If my memory serves correctly, didn't this make it into Jay and Silent Bob strike back? Mike, shouldn't you be getting a movie check?
What's up on Urban Dictionary is taken from Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back. I didn't write it.
Ok, didn't realize that...thanks for the clarification! Great job last night, listening to the archive today while at work. I stayed almost an hour and a half later at work then I should have, couldn't leave without hearing how it ended. The whole 3hr broadcast was stellar!
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You "take a hard line?" Seriously?
Just live and let live.
I do. It's not like I'm picketing in front of the local comic book store.
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You "take a hard line?" Seriously?
Just live and let live.
I do. It's not like I'm picketing in front of the local comic book store.
I'm a lifelong comic fan and I say be as hardass as you can. Seriously, you should be like Michael Savage, but for comic fans.
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I'm curious how B Buster defines comics. Joe Sacco's "Palestine" or Art Spiegelman's "Maus" are comics to me. Do you have a problem with works like that?
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Jay and Silent Bob are terrible, one-note jokes that only stoners laugh at. They're fucking clown shoes. If they were real, I'd beat the shit out of them for being so stupid. I can't believe Miramax would have anything to do with this shit.
I, for one, will be boycotting this movie. Who's with me?
by B. Buster Sep 13, 2004 share this
If my memory serves correctly, didn't this make it into Jay and Silent Bob strike back? Mike, shouldn't you be getting a movie check?
What's up on Urban Dictionary is taken from Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back. I didn't write it.
Shucks. I thought I had stumbled upon the legendary B.Buster in action.
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I'm curious how B Buster defines comics. Joe Sacco's "Palestine" or Art Spiegelman's "Maus" are comics to me. Do you have a problem with works like that?
Well shit, I read Marvel Adventures for six year olds from time to time (no crossover bs, so sue me) and I don't feel guilty for that. I don't consider myself a nerd either.
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I don't consider myself a nerd either.
It's not about what you think....Pidge
What Does B.Buster Think?
Someone make a bumper-sticker already.
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I'm curious how B Buster defines comics. Joe Sacco's "Palestine" or Art Spiegelman's "Maus" are comics to me. Do you have a problem with works like that?
I realize some graphic novels like Maus and Jimmy Corrigan have tackled more adult themes. I don't have a problem with that. I just think that such themes can be explored in more depth without the graphics. Of course this may be my own prejudice for words over pictures.
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Nicely done, Mike.
I was a member of the View Askew message board for a few years. I grew out of it.
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I realize some graphic novels like Maus and Jimmy Corrigan have tackled more adult themes. I don't have a problem with that. I just think that such themes can be explored in more depth without the graphics. Of course this may be my own prejudice for words over pictures.
I don't know about that. I think the best comics, like Maus, are designed for the medium and they are great because of their medium and not in spite of it. Some people might not like the aesthetic of opening a comic and reading the word balloons and looking at the pictures and I can understand that but I don't think it's fair to invalidate an entire medium. I can also think of plenty of comics that I own that simply couldn't work in any other medium. They have to be comics. And they are great! Specifically stuff like this: http://www.buenaventurapress.com/KE6/
But hey- the way this whole Kevin Smith saga has played out makes you more than A-OK with me. Classic stuff.
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I'm not trying to "invalidate an entire medium." As a kid, I was big comic book fan. Sgt. Fury, Sgt. Rock, the whole Marvel pantheon, I ate that stuff up. In the 8th grade, a friend and I started a huge mural of all the superheroes. It was such a monumental task we couldn't finish it before moving on to high school. The art teacher and some students finished it the following year and the mural hung in the school for many years.
I just think that beyond a certain age you should move on to regular books. Sort of like heavy metal music which I also enjoyed in my youth.
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I just don't get how "images and text" have to be put into two different age groups.
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I just don't get how "images and text" have to be put into two different age groups.
That's because it's silly make such a ridiculous assertion. Saying that sequential art is only for kids is absurd. I work in a bookstore, and an older guy insulted my tastes because I said that I read fiction as well as non-fiction. "Well, you'll grow up one day." Same deal, and just as silly. He can feel whoever he likes, I suppose.
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"I work in a bookstore, and an older guy insulted my tastes because I said that I read fiction as well as non-fiction"
What was he getting on your for, fiction or non-fiction? Either way, that's pretty bizarre.
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"When I was in my 20's, I was bird-dogging chicks and getting loaded."
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Good one, Dave!
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"When I was in my 20's, I was bird-dogging chicks and getting loaded."
Wait. So Mike has stopped bird-dogging chicks and getting loaded. He sounded loaded to me on Tuesday night.
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I just think that beyond a certain age you should move on to regular books.
That's just crazy talk. Edward Said, who was University Professor of English and Comparative Literature at Columbia University, said that Joe Sacco's comic book "Palestine" was one of the best distillations of the conflict he'd ever read. There are adults comics.
Speaking for myself I never read any superhero comics of any kind when I was a kid and I still don't. I didn't get into comics until I was 25 years old, 15 years after I started reading regular books, and I can't get enough. Some I read for fun, some I read for the art and some I read to learn something new. And I still read regular books.
Anyways an internet argument is never going to convince you to change your mind about comic books but I hope you'll maybe check out some of the more respected adult comics out there and see if any of those change your mind. You're missing out.
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Not a big fan of Edward Said. I'm not surprised he said that considering he probably agreed with the politics of "Palestine."
I tried to sample the cream of the crop of graphic novels. I own Maus, Jimmy Corrigan, Watchmen, The Dark Knight Returns, David Boring, etc. I've tried to read a few of them. I've finished none of them. As I said, it's probably a personal thing. The stories didn't grab me and the pictures didn't help.
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But in Palestine, Sacco mentions that he wants to give a story from the Israeli side as well.
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
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Is Smith really oblivious to The Best Show's opinion of him and his works? Hasn't someone from his message board said 'hey that guy's been trashing you for years'?
I've been waiting for a Smith Vs. Scharpling confrontation, but that call just left me confused.
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
You might start by pondering the question "did I get the joke?"
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
You might start by pondering the question "did I get the joke?"
Excellent advice!
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
yeah totally, i don't get it either! I think Tom maybe took the heat off Kevin by countering Mike's opinions during the phone call?? but I'm confused.
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Next week on The Mike Show, Ryan Adams in studio with his musical tribute to Tom Waits.
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
yeah totally, i don't get it either! I think Tom maybe took the heat off Kevin by countering Mike's opinions during the phone call?? but I'm confused.
My impression was that Kevin Smith is largely unaware of The Best Show but is super aware of Mike and of his total disdain for his movies. With Tom, and TBS in general, so far off Smith's radar, Tom was able to make the inside joke to us (the audience) of him being a Smith fan. And why not? It wasn't like Smith was lured to the show by someone posing as a fan.
In fact, what I learned from the interview is that, as much as Tom hates KS, Mike might hate him even more. And it's apparently been out in the open for some time.
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
yeah totally, i don't get it either! I think Tom maybe took the heat off Kevin by countering Mike's opinions during the phone call?? but I'm confused.
My impression was that Kevin Smith is largely unaware of The Best Show but is super aware of Mike and of his total disdain for his movies. With Tom, and TBS in general, so far off Smith's radar, Tom was able to make the inside joke to us (the audience) of him being a Smith fan. And why not? It wasn't like Smith was lured to the show by someone posing as a fan.
In fact, what I learned from the interview is that, as much as Tom hates KS, Mike might hate him even more. And it's apparently been out in the open for some time.
I don't really care one way or another. On the other hand, outside of the Pee Wee-ish whiff of "I MEANT to do that", this mostly makes sense.
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I dont know what to think about all this "all the sudden Tom is a Kevin Smith fan once hes on the phone".
yeah totally, i don't get it either! I think Tom maybe took the heat off Kevin by countering Mike's opinions during the phone call?? but I'm confused.
My impression was that Kevin Smith is largely unaware of The Best Show but is super aware of Mike and of his total disdain for his movies. With Tom, and TBS in general, so far off Smith's radar, Tom was able to make the inside joke to us (the audience) of him being a Smith fan. And why not? It wasn't like Smith was lured to the show by someone posing as a fan.
In fact, what I learned from the interview is that, as much as Tom hates KS, Mike might hate him even more. And it's apparently been out in the open for some time.
This is one interpretation. I will be curious to see if Tom mentions it next week to explain his thinking, or if this just stands as another Best Show Mystery for the ages.
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man you guys can analyze the fun out of anything!
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"I work in a bookstore, and an older guy insulted my tastes because I said that I read fiction as well as non-fiction"
What was he getting on your for, fiction or non-fiction? Either way, that's pretty bizarre.
He thought non-fiction books were the only ones worth reading. Fiction was "for kids". I'll stop hijacking the thread now.
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I think Kevin Smith made it pretty clear during their chat - at one point and time he was very concerned with what people thought about him/his movies, but over time he's realized that people are always going to take shots for whatever reasons and now lets it roll off his back. He openly credited the bbuster experience with helping him get to that point and seemed genuinely thankful to be in that place now.
To that end I doubt appearing on an openly hostile forum like TBS really concerns him - whether he knows it's hostile or not. I thought all parties handled it very well. And Tom saying he was a fan was definitely an inside joke meant for the listeners.
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I think the main point is that he DEFINITELY knew that AP Mike wasn't exactly a fan and he came on anyway. I really like the fact that they had an aggressive online relationship, but when they happened to meet the animosity kind of fizzled.
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I think the main point is that he DEFINITELY knew that AP Mike wasn't exactly a fan and he came on anyway. I really like the fact that they had an aggressive online relationship, but when they happened to meet the animosity kind of fizzled.
Makes you wonder what would happen in (fill in the name of your favorite miscreant) showed up at a Tom meet and greet.
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I think the main point is that he DEFINITELY knew that AP Mike wasn't exactly a fan and he came on anyway. I really like the fact that they had an aggressive online relationship, but when they happened to meet the animosity kind of fizzled.
Makes you wonder what would happen in (fill in the name of your favorite miscreant) showed up at a Tom meet and greet.
...with a cooler full of fish.