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FOT Community => Links => Topic started by: JesseFromVegas on August 25, 2011, 06:45:53 PM

Title: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JesseFromVegas on August 25, 2011, 06:45:53 PM
http://www.avclub.com/chicago/articles/billy-corgan-gets-in-a-nasty-internet-fight-with-a,60967/ (http://www.avclub.com/chicago/articles/billy-corgan-gets-in-a-nasty-internet-fight-with-a,60967/)

He's been awful for years but this is the first time I've out and out hated him rather than just been bewildered/entertained by his insanity.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Smelodies on August 25, 2011, 11:46:45 PM
Seems to be a lot of pissing back and forth on both sides, judging from a very cursory look.

All I can say is, why not walk into a Guitar Center and buy an effects pedal there?  They got a million to choose from.  I can't imagine hiring someone to make some kind of esoteric guitar pedal when every sound under the sun is already available at any given instrument store.  You have too many choices, really.  Which brings me to my next thought: electric guitar players use too many effects.  Here's hoping the clean tone comes back.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: daveB from Oakland on August 26, 2011, 12:43:14 AM
Jesse -- I read that same article and also had the thought of posting something about it here. My subject heading was gonna be something like "Is Billy Corgan the most hideous A-hole ever??"

I saw Corgan's side project, Zwan, play on Letterman one time, and I actually kind of liked it. But then I saw an interview with one of the guys from Zwan  (http://www.avclub.com/articles/random-rules-dave-pajo-of-dead-child,2277/)and he had some hilarious stories about Billy's monumental jerkiness.

Also, the closest Shudder to Think ever came to "the big time" was an opening slot for the Smushing Pupkins. Shudder to Think was a million times better than the Smushing Pupkins.

Also, the AV club onetime posted that video of Billy giving a lecture to his audience about how they should receive his newer material with just as much enthusiasm as they would receive his older material. (Okay, now I feel like I'm doing a big advertisement for the AV Klub. Sorry, Tom).

Also, anyone who expends a lot of energy towards getting mad at Kanye West should redirect that energy towards getting mad at Billy Corgan.

Also, Billy Corgan can go jump in a lake. That right, I said it. He can Jump. Into. A. Lake.

Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Shaggy 2 Grote on August 26, 2011, 09:30:04 AM
Doesn't he not believe in the moon or something?
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JesseFromVegas on August 26, 2011, 11:20:53 AM
Doesn't he not believe in the moon or something?

I have to know the context behind this.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Shaggy 2 Grote on August 26, 2011, 01:51:03 PM
I don't know, I remember hearing something crazy, like he thinks the earth is flat or hollow or something like that. I haven't checked my Google alert for Billy Corgan in a while.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: effecT on August 26, 2011, 02:03:17 PM
I don't know, I remember hearing something crazy, like he thinks the earth is flat or hollow or something like that. I haven't checked my Google alert for Billy Corgan in a while.

Hey!
We're called hollow-earthers and have feelings too!!!
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on August 26, 2011, 02:14:17 PM
I don't know, I remember hearing something crazy, like he thinks the earth is flat or hollow or something like that. I haven't checked my Google alert for Billy Corgan in a while.

He thinks the world is a vampire.



Sinbad's up next.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: effecT on August 26, 2011, 02:58:29 PM
I don't know, I remember hearing something crazy, like he thinks the earth is flat or hollow or something like that. I haven't checked my Google alert for Billy Corgan in a while.

He thinks the world is a vampire.


(http://nsa27.casimages.com/img/2011/08/26/110826090532621961.jpg)
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: KickTheBobo on August 26, 2011, 03:45:44 PM
yeah, he's a dick.

He did, however, create Siamese Dream, which is one of the best albums ever made.

Gotta separate the art from the artist I guess.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Omar on August 26, 2011, 07:09:30 PM
yeah, he's a dick.

He did, however, create Siamese Dream, which is one of the best albums ever made.

Gotta separate the art from the artist I guess.

When I saw William with a shaved head on the 11/11/95 installment of SNL (QT as host!), I knew he was finished. That is the official turning point.  Gish-Lull EP-Siamese Dream- the stuff collected on the Pisces Iscariot comp-Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness (and the excellent "Zero" EP)  is a better run than most, though. Adore is a passable change of pace, and there are a few solid tracks on Machina/The Machines of God + Machina II/The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music (not even sure if the latter was ever officially released).  The Zwan album is pretty good.  Zeitgeist is gross.

I do regret that damn back bathroom area tattoo: Ms. Wretzky riding a unicorn as the rest of the band members loitered bottomless in the background.  It was inked by some heroin-drenched reprobate who claimed that he once participated in a threesome with Courtney Love ("C-Lo") and Falling James Moreland.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 26, 2011, 11:16:31 PM
yeah, he's a dick.

He did, however, create Siamese Dream, which is one of the best albums ever made.

Gotta separate the art from the artist I guess.

When I saw William with a shaved head on the 11/11/95 installment of SNL (QT as host!), I knew he was finished. That is the official turning point.  Gish-Lull EP-Siamese Dream- the stuff collected on the Pisces Iscariot comp-Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness (and the excellent "Zero" EP)  is a better run than most, though. Adore is a passable change of pace, and there are a few solid tracks on Machina/The Machines of God + Machina II/The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music (not even sure if the latter was ever officially released).  The Zwan album is pretty good.  Zeitgeist is gross.


I agree 100% with you on the Smashing Pumpkins stuff.  I only heard the one Zwan song.

I really liked their stuff, in spite of its flaws (maybe, in some cases, because of them).

If I were going to reevaluate their catalog, I would point out that not reducing Mellon Collie to one record was so perfectly parallel to not reducing Use Your Illusion to one record that it's amazing that no one's written a book comparing and contrasting the two great one-man-band flameouts of the 1990s.

And both named Billy to boot.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on August 27, 2011, 12:38:22 AM

If I were going to reevaluate their catalog, I would point out that not reducing Mellon Collie to one record was so perfectly parallel to not reducing Use Your Illusion to one record that it's amazing that no one's written a book comparing and contrasting the two great one-man-band flameouts of the 1990s.

And both named Billy to boot.

As bad as Melon Collie is,  I cannot compare it to the stinking wreck that is Use Your Illusions I and II.  Those things sound like they were recorded underwater and mixed by a chimp.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: dave from knoxville on August 27, 2011, 07:34:05 AM
I liked the guitar sound, could never get beyond the voice.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Omar on August 27, 2011, 12:53:56 PM

If I were going to reevaluate their catalog, I would point out that not reducing Mellon Collie to one record was so perfectly parallel to not reducing Use Your Illusion to one record that it's amazing that no one's written a book comparing and contrasting the two great one-man-band flameouts of the 1990s.

And both named Billy to boot.

As bad as Melon Collie is,  I cannot compare it to the stinking wreck that is Use Your Illusions I and II.  Those things sound like they were recorded underwater and mixed by a chimp.

MC&TIS, UYI I, and UYI II are all awesome (and/or awesomely bloated), though certainly weaker than the bands' previous LP.  Most albums are weaker than Appetite and Siamese Dreams'll Come Through, though.  It's worth noting that I'm someone who can name all four "classic lineup" members of the Bulletboys* without consulting Wikipedia, so my take on musics is perhaps at odds with most observers.

Eric Weisbard's 33 1/3 series installment on UYI I and II is well worth a read.  He digs into a lot of the things that make those two albums very interesting -- i.e., a sonic voyage into the strange mind of W. Axl Rose. I find the push-and-pull of Axl's Elton-and-Queen thing he was into at the time vs. the Slash/Izzy/Duff approach to be quite thrilling. 

*Marq Torien1, Mick Sweda, Lonnie Vencent, and Jimmy D'Anda.

1. Torien was briefly a guitarist for Ratt circa 1982 and auditioned for Ozzy Osbourne after the death of Randall Rhoads.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 27, 2011, 01:37:51 PM
Omar: I rate Mellon Collie pretty highly, I was saying (in agreement with you) that it's bloated.  It has a higher % of good songs than UYI I/II.

Scores are in comparison to "classic" Pumpkins.  I've just done what any half-decent A&R man should have done to this monster.

"Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness" - Gentle instrumental.  Pretty memorable.  7.5
"Tonight, Tonight" - Really good.  9
"Jellybelly" - Cannot remember this song by title.  Listening to it now.  Solid, I listen to it if it comes up on the iPod.  Better than other songs like it on this record.  8. 
"Zero" - Great single.  8.5.
"Here Is No Why" - Here we reach the first one I would have cut.  B-side.  5.
"Bullet with Butterfly Wings" - Great first line.  Overplayed at this point.  7.5.
"To Forgive" - Better upon repeat listenings.  8.
"An Ode to No One" - Cut this one.  Save for the next outtakes record.  Good ending.  6.
"Love" - Foreshadowing their (his) later no-so-good stuff.  Cut.  3.5. 
"Cupid de Locke" - Foreshadowing his later, somewhat ok stuff.  On the border of cutting.  6.
"Galapogos" - Is this song about turtles?  Too much of the high-low happy-sad loud-quiet Corgan.  Outtake.  5.
"Muzzle" - The first line sums up the whole tortured genius thing.  Cut. 5.5.
"Porcelina of the Vast Oceans"  - This song is the perfect centerpiece for a curiosities record.  Cut from this project.  7.
"Take Me Down" - I hate all James Iha songs.  Learn from Gene Simmons, don't let your bad-singing guitarist... never mind.  1.


"Where Boys Fear to Tread" - This one-two punch should have opened the record.  9.5
"Bodies" - The best song on the album, for my money. 10.
"Thirty-Three" - Good.  8.
"In the Arms of Sleep" - Underrated.  I wish he wouldn't sing with the unbelievably whiny voice as opposed to the "wow, that's whiny" voice.  7.5
"1979" - Great single.  Overplayed now.  7.5.
"Tales of a Scorched Earth" - Much worse than the other heavy songs on MC.  3.
"Thru the Eyes of Ruby" - Absolute garbage.  Quit doing novelty songs.  3.
"Stumbleine" - The last good song on the record.  This belongs on Pisces Iscariot II.  6.
"X.Y.U." - Boring and gross.  3.
"We Only Come Out at Night" - There's a difference between Billy singing in that weird voice and just singing off-key.  3.5
"Beautiful" - Stop trying to involve the rest of the band.  2.
"Lily (My One and Only)" - Stop indulging yourself so much, Billy.  3.
"By Starlight" - Awful, awful, awful.  1.5.
"Farewell and Goodnight" - It's a good thing they stopped working together.  I wonder if those bearded dudes wrote songs.  2.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Omar on August 27, 2011, 02:00:47 PM
A 3 for "Thru The Eyes of Ruby"?! That's nuts.  In what context is this a "novelty song"?  It's one of the best songs on the album.

I would rate "Here Is No Why," "Muzzle," and some others a bit higher (I'd be lower on "Zero"), but these relative ratings are certainly reasonable.  I do recall thinking that "Cupid de Locke" was hideous, but perhaps I'm thinking of another track?  Wait, that's the one where Billy says "hath" and "doth," yes?  It is hideous!  I'd give that song a ... Zero!  Circa 1995-1996, I always got a charge out of the explosive end of "X.Y.U."  The post-"X.Y.U." stuff on Disc 2 does indeed end the set on a very dull note; the lullaby finale is quite fitting. 

Good call on that "Where Boys Fear to Tread"/"Bodies" 1-2 punch.

Should I start a thread on Veruca Salt?
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: daveB from Oakland on August 27, 2011, 02:59:52 PM
Based on this thread, I'm thinking at some point I should try and listen to "Mellon Collie" with open ears and an open heart. But man, some of those song titles. I think the "Mip Hamine" guy could have come up with better stuff than ...

"Jellybelly" ....

"Here Is No Why" ...

"Cupid de Locke" ...

"Porcelina of the Vast Oceans" ...
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Paul DeLouisiana on August 27, 2011, 03:42:24 PM
The Smashing Pumpkins made me happy in highschool but I really feel no reason to revisit them. I can say the same about Oasis. It's weird to talk to someone in their 20s or 30s who still have these two near the top of their list.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 27, 2011, 04:30:53 PM
A 3 for "Thru The Eyes of Ruby"?! That's nuts.  In what context is this a "novelty song"?  It's one of the best songs on the album.


Oops!  I didn't listen to them all.  I was confusing this one with "Lily, My One and Only," which I inexplicably reviewed twice.  I'm not a huge fan of "Thru the Eyes of Ruby," but I'd give it more like a 7.

Quote

I would rate "Here Is No Why," "Muzzle," and some others a bit higher (I'd be lower on "Zero"), but these relative ratings are certainly reasonable.  I do recall thinking that "Cupid de Locke" was hideous, but perhaps I'm thinking of another track?  Wait, that's the one where Billy says "hath" and "doth," yes?  It is hideous!  I'd give that song a ... Zero!  Circa 1995-1996, I always got a charge out of the explosive end of "X.Y.U."  The post-"X.Y.U." stuff on Disc 2 does indeed end the set on a very dull note; the lullaby finale is quite fitting. 


I didn't realize when I started how many of my least favorite songs are right in a row on the last side.  It's as if Roger Waters had put a long and bizarre song that's more like the angriest Andrew Lloyd Weber number ever on Side 4 of the Wall, but of course he wouldn't do that.

Quote

Good call on that "Where Boys Fear to Tread"/"Bodies" 1-2 punch.


I think I might even put this up as a dark horse for "best 1-2 punch" on any album.  I can't overstate how much I like these two and like them together as the start of a record (albeit of Disc 2).

Quote

Should I start a thread on Veruca Salt?


Well, you know... you... you can't fight... um ... Seether.


Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Omar on August 27, 2011, 05:15:21 PM


Should I start a thread on Veruca Salt?


Well, you know... you... you can't fight... um ... Seether.

I've decided against Veruca Salt thread creation.  I was unable to locate my erotic haiku about Nina Gordon, so it's pointless.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: CSW on August 27, 2011, 06:18:25 PM
I think we all know that Gene Simmons is, and forever will be, the biggest creep in music.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Anthony from Ireland on August 27, 2011, 08:58:38 PM
aw, I really like the second half of disc 2 of Mellon Collie.
Initially I thought Tales Of A Scorched Earth was heavy by numbers but now it's one of my favourites. I love the production on that song.
I was a big fan of the Pumpkins up to that album. Saw an interview with Billy on Irish TV around the Mellon Collie time and thought he was cool. Made a lot of good points and came across as an enthusiastic musician who loved what he was doing.
I think the craziness came with the baldness. By the time Adore came out I wasn't bothered.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 27, 2011, 09:29:46 PM
aw, I really like the second half of disc 2 of Mellon Collie.
Initially I thought Tales Of A Scorched Earth was heavy by numbers but now it's one of my favourites. I love the production on that song.
I was a big fan of the Pumpkins up to that album. Saw an interview with Billy on Irish TV around the Mellon Collie time and thought he was cool. Made a lot of good points and came across as an enthusiastic musician who loved what he was doing.
I think the craziness came with the baldness. By the time Adore came out I wasn't bothered.

Gummoer, 

"We Only Come Out at Night"
"Beautiful"
"Lily (My One and Only)"
"By Starlight"
"Farewell and Goodnight"

I really like Siamese Dream and most of Gish and most of Adore (and a lot of Mellon Collie).  These songs make me angry at Billy Corgan for some reason - maybe because they are all sort of a departure from anything they did before or since?  I think it makes sense to either like or dislike them as a group.

It's funny that people can have such divergent thoughts about parts of a band's oeuvre. 

I'm still waiting for a full-throated defense of Peter Criss' solo album.  Surely someone out there likes it!

Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Anthony from Ireland on August 29, 2011, 05:01:18 AM
yep, I like that little section of the album. Happily play just that section sometimes.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: puppycity on August 29, 2011, 04:42:11 PM
This is one take on his setup
http://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/117-smashing-pumpkins-billy-corgan-guitar-gear-rig-and-equipment (http://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/117-smashing-pumpkins-billy-corgan-guitar-gear-rig-and-equipment)

I saw the Smashing Pumpkins close a show in Randal Island about 10 years ago and Corgan got into an argument with a guy in a Pantera shirt long enough that Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds were no longer able to take the stage by the time he got off his soapbox due to time constraints. It was like getting a lecture at an Allman Brother show.

Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 29, 2011, 06:23:20 PM
This is one take on his setup
http://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/117-smashing-pumpkins-billy-corgan-guitar-gear-rig-and-equipment (http://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/117-smashing-pumpkins-billy-corgan-guitar-gear-rig-and-equipment)

I saw the Smashing Pumpkins close a show in Randal Island about 10 years ago and Corgan got into an argument with a guy in a Pantera shirt long enough that Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds were no longer able to take the stage by the time he got off his soapbox due to time constraints. It was like getting a lecture at an Allman Brother show.


Dickey Betts was famous for his disquisitions at the Fillmore, if memory serves.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Omar on August 29, 2011, 07:52:51 PM

"Take Me Down" - I hate all James Iha songs.  Learn from Gene Simmons, don't let your bad-singing guitarist... never mind.  1.


I would generally agree, although I've always enjoyed Jim's "The Boy" from the "1979 single.  It's a good pop ditty to my ears.

Smashing Pumpkins - The Boy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vc0lcV98YB8#)
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: nec13 on August 29, 2011, 08:43:11 PM
Hexen may be the greatest thing that Billy Corgan was ever a part of.

HEXEN Song1 1985 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNaoGjfsjEw#ws)
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 30, 2011, 03:12:50 PM

"Take Me Down" - I hate all James Iha songs.  Learn from Gene Simmons, don't let your bad-singing guitarist... never mind.  1.


I would generally agree, although I've always enjoyed Jim's "The Boy" from the "1979 single.  It's a good pop ditty to my ears.

Smashing Pumpkins - The Boy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vc0lcV98YB8#)



This is better than his other stuff.  Just can't stand his singing.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 30, 2011, 03:15:29 PM
Hexen may be the greatest thing that Billy Corgan was ever a part of.

HEXEN Song1 1985 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNaoGjfsjEw#ws)


I find it comforting to see that all the awkward gawping was there from the beginning and not a later affectation.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Shaggy 2 Grote on August 30, 2011, 06:10:10 PM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: dave from knoxville on August 31, 2011, 05:58:35 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?

No. No you don't.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Wes on August 31, 2011, 09:09:46 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?
Not only do I think you should revisit the Pumpkins' music, Grote, I think you and Omar should compete to see if either of you can be the one to finally solve the mysteries of the Machina/Machines of God alternate reality game mystery.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: buffcoat on August 31, 2011, 10:45:34 AM
I find about 25 songs from the Pumpkins catalog (Gish through Adore, about 2 songs after that ) to be among the best stuff that came out in the 1990s.  Another 50% of it is very listenable.  It's the last bit, plus the fact that Billy Corgan really can't sing, that turns people all the way off.

Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Shaggy 2 Grote on August 31, 2011, 02:32:37 PM
Wait, what's the mystery, Wes? Corrigan's diagrams couldn't be clearer.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/49/Machina_chart.jpg)

Listening to Siamese Dream and remembering that I listened to it quite a bit in my senior year of college. In my defense, I was very, very high. It does still hold up pretty well.

Also, Kiss! How could I forget that these boards made me revisit Kiss. Though I never really visited them in the first place.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: masterofsparks on September 19, 2011, 03:57:53 AM
I think Gish holds up very well, better than Siamese Dream. I never really listened to Melln Collie at the time and I'm reluctant to do so now, but who knows what'll happen.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: The guest show on September 19, 2011, 08:13:00 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?

No. No you don't.

man you suck.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on September 19, 2011, 09:30:10 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?

Bob Seger has some great songs (e.g. Hollywood Nights), but I will never forgive him for "Yellow Beret." 

The Ballad of the Yellow Beret (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pBdL8chkuM#)

Not Fonda Bob.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: dave from knoxville on September 19, 2011, 09:46:00 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?

No. No you don't.

man you suck.

What did I do to deserve this asshole?
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on September 19, 2011, 09:54:07 AM
You people have already compelled me to revisit my opinions on Bob Seger and ZZ Top. Now I have to go back and listen to Smashing Pumpkins too?

No. No you don't.

man you suck.

What did I do to deserve this asshole?

You had an opinion.  Shame on you!
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: The guest show on September 19, 2011, 10:27:30 AM
Dave you need to relax. 
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Big Plastic Head on September 19, 2011, 08:49:13 PM
Dave you need to relax.
Your board name should be SHIT IN THE PUNCHBOWL.

And I mean that in the nicest possible way.

OR DO I!?

I don't.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: dave from knoxville on September 19, 2011, 09:09:03 PM
Dave you need to relax.
Your board name should be SHIT IN THE PUNCHBOWL.

And I mean that in the nicest possible way.

OR DO I!?

I don't.

Wait, me?
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Big Plastic Head on September 19, 2011, 09:29:51 PM
Dave you need to relax.
Your board name should be SHIT IN THE PUNCHBOWL.

And I mean that in the nicest possible way.

OR DO I!?

I don't.

Wait, me?

Of course not, Dave. You sir, are a board gentleman.
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: Shaggy 2 Grote on September 19, 2011, 10:47:54 PM
Wow, that Yellow Beret song. The pre-Silver Bullet Band comp I found on some disreputable blog is all hippie-psych stuff -- "2+2=?," the big single from it (I think) is pretty representative of the time, with vaguely anti-authoritarian lyrics. Evidently, Seger didn't have much in the way of artistic or moral principles. Maybe he's like that patriotic Wurster character who agrees to write a song for Saddam.

That said, even "fake" psych rock can sound pretty good (see: Kenny Rogers and the First Edition, every single song on every single one of those millions of psych comps), and I was surprised how listenable that comp was.

Smashing Pumpkins = OK. I remembered a couple of the songs from Gish and Siamese Dream that I liked a lot in the 90s and then forgot about. I'm not sure every single song holds up, but I thoroughly enjoyed much of it.

(Edited to fix the name of "2+2=?," which I had misidentified as "2+2=5," which is a Radiohead song)
Title: Re: Billy Corgan: Biggest creep in music?
Post by: masterofsparks on September 20, 2011, 03:36:11 AM
Yeah, Seger's Ballad of the Yellow Beret is pretty disgusting, but played alongside 2+2=? it becomes more mystifying than anything. A tour through through his early (pre-Silver Bullet Band) stuff finds a guy clearly searching hard for a musical identity, so I have no problem forgiving a misstep like Yellow Beret. It's clearly an anomaly in his catalog, so I'll put it down to a youthful ignorance. We've all said something dumb in our youth, his just happens to have been set to music and pressed to vinyl.

If you haven't heard it, 2+2=? is one of the most powerful anti-war songs of its era.