Have You Seen...?

[Bryan]

Has anyone else got this book "Have You Seen...?" by David Thomson? I'd spotted it in bookstores before Christmas, and without thinking too hard about it, dismissed it as one of those books for people who don't read books - 1000 movies you MUST see before you die.

It's not really like that. It's a series of short, movie review-length personal essays. Thomson is pretty brilliant and somewhat eccentric (he describes Eddie Constantine in Alphaville as looking like a "1000 year old lizard".) I'm still on letter A, and I've already come across a handful of movies that I haven't heard of before.

[Martin]

Thomson is also of the mind that we live in an age when all young people (ie everyone not of his generation) are brainless philistines who are completely uninterested in CINEMA, who revel in shallow entertainment, who couldn't care less about genuine movie theatres and classic CINEMA, and who wouldn't know Sergei Parajanov from Jan Troell if you beat them over the head with a copy of Cahiérs du cinéma. As I see it, this tome is his way of vainly saying, "Sorry CINEMA, I tried to teach them, but they wouldn't listen".

Apart from that - and I really hate that kind of ignorant snobbery (can you tell?), which is based on nothing (and nostalgia) - I do agree that it's a fun book with lots of interesting reco's, and I suppose a personal guide to the world of cinema is, in the end, more interesting than the books that claim to represent an irrefutable canon.

[yesno]

I think it would be fun to try to out-snob people like that to see how they react.  If he thinks people don't watch proper CINEMA today, then I'd claim to have never seen a movie at all.  Someone gets all indie snob on me, I deny listening to any "pop" music at all.

With all things snobbish my unsubstantiated theory is that roughly the same percentage of the population is involved in snobbish pursuits as ever.  What exact snobbish pursuits those are might vary; surely a small percentage of people read poetry now that in the 19th century, but I think I'm correct for snobbishness overall.

What bugs the snobs is that they are drowned out nowadays by the slob masses who dare to attend school and start blogs nowadays instead of simply toiling in the fields.

[Sarah]

I still remember happily the time when, having gone out for drinks with a bunch of poets who were strenuously poeting it up in front of me, I responded to one who asked me condescendingly what I thought of Gertrude Stein by saying, "Oh, is she the one who wrote 'Roses, roses, everywhere, nor any drop to drink'?"   

[buffcoat]

I only listen to Bernard Gluckman's air mixes.

[Bryan]

This type of snobbery is so not an issue in my life. Having lived in a cultural backwater for a few years now, I'd be delighted to meet someone who cared enough to be a snob about any art form. Same with all the belly-aching about hipsters. All the students at the university in town are like villains from a John Hughes movie. A few hipsters would really improve the place.

[masterofsparks]

I still remember happily the time when, having gone out for drinks with a bunch of poets who were strenuously poeting it up in front of me, I responded to one who asked me condescendingly what I thought of Gertrude Stein by saying, "Oh, is she the one who wrote 'Roses, roses, everywhere, nor any drop to drink'?"   

This reminds me of a great story from a friend of mine - his then-wife was a graduate student in the Art History department at Ohio State. He's an extraordinarily smart man, probably the smartest person I've ever met, but he occasionally enjoys playing the part of the ignorant rube in public and there's just enough of that in his actual background to allow him to fool most people. Anyway, he's talking to a woman at this art history department event and she asks him, "So, did you two meet through the arts?," to which he drawlingly replies, "No, I'm more of an NRA than NEA-type of guy."

[<<<<<]

Same with all the belly-aching about hipsters. All the students at the university in town are like villains from a John Hughes movie. A few hipsters would really improve the place.

Only hyper-self-aware hipsters moan about hipsters.  It's the sort of hand-wringing suitable for the goth scene, where insisting that one is not actually "goth" is such a reliable behavior, it's a prerequisite to being one.

It's sort of like complaining about scenesters, when you have to be one yourself to actually identify who the scenesters are.

[iAmBaronVonTito]

**CAUTION: RANT ALERT**  

ive been accused of being both hip and a scenester when i am strcitly a jeans and tshirt slob who enjoys music no one i seem to know has heard of and watch movies of the same caliber.  i dont choose the lifestyle for any perks, i merely dont think shows like House or Nip/Tuck and music like Katy Perry aren't worth wasting my time on, but no judgement is passed for those who like those things.  at any rate, its frustrating, so i make a point to call out on hipster hate.  in my opinion, it comes down to the fact that it's not the "hipsters/scenesters" they dont like, its seeing the same thing everywhere you look.  

albeit, there are individuals who enjoy letting you know that youre not in the know, but we all know what those kind of people are really made of- it doesnt make the whole bunch sour.  

[crumbum]

I think it was in an interview with Henry from Chunklet where he defined the hipster as someone who forces him/herself to like scene-approved things for the sake of appearances. That definition nicely explains the fact that no one will admit to being one.

The big Toronto alt weekly, Now, recently did a cover feature on 'the death of the Hipster' (the idea being that Obama killed their cynicism). Apparently when they wanted to get some photos of the species on the street they told people that it was for an article about hipsters but left out the death part; still, no one would allow themselves to be photographed so the cover was staged instead.

[iAmBaronVonTito]

by favorite quote on hipsters is:

GD: What’s your definition of a hipster?

AE: My definition of a hipster? I have no idea what a hipster is in 2008? I don’t think that term has a concrete definition at all. I think that it may have like in 1996 or 1997, in 2008 I think it’s a blanket term used by the media to describe a certain demographic between the ages of 18 and 34 that doesn’t really exist in concrete terms. I mean I sort of know what you mean, but also we’re in a day and age where my mom is a hipster. So it’s not like that term or somebody being regarded as a hipster should in no way in 2008 be seen as some badge of integrity or some cool thing. I don’t think it means anything right now. Tell me a band, not in your opinion, but tell me a band that you think is very popular in hipster circles?

GD: I actually don’t listen to that much new music. I only listen to Van Halen. I’m a big Van Halen supporter.

AE: Then you tell me something that you think is very popular in hipster circles? Would you consider Pitchfork to be popular in hipster circles?

GD: I actually read Pitchfork, it’s a daily source of news for me. It’s like CNN in certain regards. They have good news reporting, I don’t know? That’s kind of why I was asking you?

AE: Pitchfork may be useful in terms of going to the website and being able to absorb some information on the level of, “oh that band’s in the studio now,” or “that band’s reunited,” or “that band’s going on tour or putting out a new record.” In terms of music criticism, I think that that is one of the most disturbing and just horrifying examples right now. I really think that there’s an alarming degree of band writing on Pitchfork. I don’t know what that is? I don’t know what causes it? It just seems like a lot of writers just trying very hard to be caustic and mean and cruel and funny, and they’re very bad at all those things. And it’s very obvious that they’re trying too hard. But in terms of hipsters, I have no idea what a hipster is? If you took something like Flight of the Conchords, and took the demographic that that show is very popular with, I don’t necessarily know that that demographic is maybe; I don’t know man? I can’t give you a definition of a hipster. I can’t do it. I have no idea?

GD: There it is.

[mcphee from the forum]

For those who don't know, that's God damned interviewing the Arts & Entertainment channel