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The Best Show on WFMU => Show Discussion => Topic started by: JonFromMaplewood on October 07, 2011, 01:55:35 PM

Title: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on October 07, 2011, 01:55:35 PM
Yesterday, I sat listening to Wally Wackiman's call from Tuesday's show.  I was admittedly distracted, taking in the conversation but also doing some mundane work for my 9-to-5 job.  As the call progressed, I found myself thinking the following types of thoughts - ones that I know many of you have experienced when listening to Wally's calls:


But then I had the "other thought"...the thought that interrupts all previous thoughts; the thought that flips all of the other thoughts on their ear: "This is a puppet."

I suddenly find myself embarrassed that I held all of those previous opinions...or any opinion on the subject at all.  Why am I getting mad about a puppet?  And who am I getting mad at?  Who is not funny? Who is defensive?  The puppet or the puppeteer? I get the sense that the puppeteer has all of these issues, but if it is indeed the puppeteer who is really unfunny and defensive, wouldn't he have left this game a long time ago?  The pure tenacity has me thinking that there is a lot more going on there.  And isn't the tenacity in and of itself funny?  All of these profound questions about actions and agency...inspired by a puppet! The mind reels. It happens every time I hear him on the air.  The moment I begin to judge Wally, I am forced instead to judge myself.

Let me go further. The only other showbiz personality I can think of who so successfully confused and frustrated people was Andy Kaufman.  That's right, I just compared Wally Wackiman to Andy Kaufman. And I will stand by that.  Would anyone argue that Andy said funny things when dressed as Tony Clifton or that his comments cracked us up when he went on his pro wrestling bender?  I doubt it.  What was funny was the tenacity and the absurdity, not any particular statement or pratfall. And like Wally, he always left me wondering; was the anger real or part of the gag. Much of the genius lay in his blurring of the line between performer and performance. 

Other than the fact that his existence forces us to address difficult epistemological questions, consider some other points in Wally's favor:

So to Wally's detractors I say "have at it."  Detract away as is your right.  But please consider the points above, many of which we are all aware, but perhaps we do not revisit quite enough.

Maybe, just maybe, if the Apple "Think Different" advertisement is updated for 2011, in between shots of Einstein and Picasso, there will be a few seconds of footage of a purple puppet, turning towards the camera in slow motion, his eye falling out in the process.

Have a good weekend.

-Jon
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JesseFromVegas on October 07, 2011, 02:31:39 PM
If Wally's personality is purposely calculated to get the reactions it gets, then Zach is a genius.

Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Crusherkc on October 07, 2011, 02:31:39 PM

  • Has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium is the radio? What a wonderfully stupid idea.


Well, Charlie McCarthy was a star on old-timey radio but your defense of Wally will hopefully put to rest the Great Feltdown.

I'm a FOWW
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: ChipSuey on October 07, 2011, 02:33:54 PM
Well said. 
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Paul DeLouisiana on October 07, 2011, 02:37:35 PM
I'd like to agree with you but I suggest you reread MiddleBro's posts. It seems like that user and Wally have very similar attitudes towards criticism. Also even if it is the puppets personality, it isn't very funny.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on October 07, 2011, 02:39:32 PM

  • Has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium is the radio? What a wonderfully stupid idea.


Well, Charlie McCarthy was a star on old-timey radio...

Fair enough. But McCarthy also had a Vaudeville act and appeared in films which justified the puppetry. As far as I know, Wally has no outlets that show him moving other than his cameo in "Fantasia in Best Show Minor."
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: B_Buster on October 07, 2011, 02:43:46 PM
If Wally's personality is purposely calculated to get the reactions it gets, then Zach is a genius.

We all know it's not which is where Jon's thesis falls to pieces.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Hugman 3.0 on October 07, 2011, 02:46:00 PM
I hate this thesis to pieces!
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on October 07, 2011, 02:54:14 PM
If Wally's personality is purposely calculated to get the reactions it gets, then Zach is a genius.

We all know it's not which is where Jon's thesis falls to pieces.

Clearly not "all."  I did not.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Spalding on October 07, 2011, 02:54:32 PM
Wally could be a descendent of Telly, the neurotic Sesame Street muppet.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JRN on October 07, 2011, 03:01:44 PM
As I've mentioned elsewhere, one of the first full episodes of the Best Show I ever listened to, and the one that really sold me on the program, featured Wally Wackiman as an in-studio guest. Not knowing much about the show at the time, I saw a puppet mentioned in the episode description and figured it would be somebody doing some kind of "foul-mouthed puppet" routine--i.e. going the obvious route of a thing associated with children saying and/or doing inappropriate things.

Imagine my surprise when Wally, a purple puppet with a funny voice and the last name "Wacky Man", was actually playing a mild-mannered straight man. I thought that was such a funny idea, particularly since, as Jon mentioned, this was a puppet on the radio, of all things. I was instantly a fan.

So while I too cringed at the call last Tuesday, I do sympathize with the Z-Man in that I'm sometimes perplexed by the particular type of razzing that Wally gets. Some of it does seem kinda mean-spirited, which strikes me as a totally odd reaction to have to such a good-natured character.

In short, I appreciate Wally a lot. I hope he can get past this unfortunate slump, shrug off the critics, and get back to being funny.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Kid Pain on October 07, 2011, 03:06:32 PM
  Would anyone argue that Andy said funny things when dressed as Tony Clifton or that his comments cracked us up when he went on his pro wrestling bender?  I doubt it. 

Andy Kaufman - I'm From Hollywood Clip (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bAQg-zWmsI#)
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Racan on October 07, 2011, 03:27:03 PM
The character just seems so slimy and self-serving, which I seriously hope is part of the act. Anytime I hear him call in I just think he's doing it for himself, and not the desire to actually contribute anything interesting to the program. I could totally be wrong, and obviously this debate is blurring the line between man and Wackiman, but has he ever been on the line with one of Tom's guests and not just shamelessly plugged himself? I'm sad to say that for me it really reeks of desperation, though this is how I feel several of the regular callers. Tom kind of nailed it when he lamented a while back that the Best Show had almost become a warped version of taking attendance.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: B_Buster on October 07, 2011, 03:37:39 PM
If Wally's personality is purposely calculated to get the reactions it gets, then Zach is a genius.

We all know it's not which is where Jon's thesis falls to pieces.

Clearly not "all."  I did not.

Well, I thought that went without saying, Jon. I just think you're giving Wally more credit than it deserves. You felt sorry for the puppet and went to great lengths to defend it. That's because you're a good guy. And Zach's a good guy, too, but his alter ego may be getting the best of him. The attention he was getting through The Best Show went to his head. He forgot the Best Show Golden Rule: it's Tom's show. That's why the ban came about in the first place. Certain callers felt obliged to call in every week to bask in the limelight of their regular caller status whether they had something interesting to contribute or not. It became a drag on the show. Of course this doesn't mean Tom and I don't appreciate the regular callers. I can honestly say that everyone I've met through the show has been great (including the puppet, whose nonexistent balls I do so enjoy busting). I think Tom gave the puppet great advice last Tues. (particularly the part about smoking a joint) and if it heeds it, I think it will continue to be a part of the show. But if it doesn't, there's always the fate of Captain Jack. Anyone miss him (well, I do a little because I like a little terror with my comedy)?
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: buffcoat on October 07, 2011, 04:33:15 PM
Tom connecting Captain J___ and Kid Kansas and then playing the song ranks in the top 5 moments in the history of the Best Show.  Still, I'm glad he's gone.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: gravy boat on October 07, 2011, 04:42:50 PM
He forgot the Best Show Golden Rule: it's my show.

It would have been so great if you had said this instead...


Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: B_Buster on October 07, 2011, 05:01:47 PM
He forgot the Best Show Golden Rule: it's my show.

It would have been so great if you had said this instead...

What if I said it in my head as I typed it? And then Skeevy said as he read it: "Yeah, right."
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Jason from Huntsville, AL on October 07, 2011, 05:31:49 PM
While I appreciate a lot of what John wrote in the OP, I don't exactly think Wally is "Kaufman-esque."

What I will say (and have said to Zach) is that Wally definitely has a life to him as a character. When he calls or is in the studio, it's so easy for me to almost forget that he's not "real" and that there's a dude running him. When I read his tweets, I hear them in that voice and picture the puppet typing them.

Whatever other criticism one has of Wally, I think the life that Zach has given this bit of purple fleece is a testament to his passion and talent.

Also, Tom's criticisms and the problem folks are having with the Feltdown don't really have anything to do with Zach lacking talent or passion or attacking him personally. I think it's about us fitting what we bring to the show into its context and what Tom's trying to do. We have to like the show more than we like being on the show or we have no business calling.

Also, I think we have to remember that these calls in an alternate universe (a comedy radio show) inside an alternate universe (the New Bridge-verse) and not take any of this stuff too personally or seriously. Again, context.

Zach & Wally have had some truly great moments on the Best Show and I'm fan of both of them. Also, I hope to never post anything this serious again on this board.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Kormod on October 07, 2011, 06:17:39 PM
I like how earlier today on Twitter, Wally called his detractors "ingrates."
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: whaleplane on October 07, 2011, 06:18:37 PM
You're giving him WAY too much credit w/r/t the whole "Kaufmanesque" thing. While the feltdown was one a personal favorite of mine, it's just not possible for it to have been a bit.

If Middle Bro wasn't so defensive on the FoT board himself, it'd be easier to grasp the idea of Wally as an overly (sometimes comically) sensitive puppet.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Rasmussen on October 07, 2011, 10:06:01 PM
I hate this thesis to pieces!
I just think the thread needs to focus more on this sentence
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: dave from knoxville on October 08, 2011, 01:51:58 AM
I consigned my dissertation to damnation.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Lawrence Orbach on October 08, 2011, 11:15:04 AM
I've enjoyed the puppet, he's better than half the regular callers and does indeed have potential for further laughs in the future. However, the cringe factor was huge when the voice started to vanish last Tues. Perhaps this was Wally's intro to the major league, that he needs to bring up his game and toughen up his felt.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Lucas on October 08, 2011, 11:40:48 AM
I like Wally's calls for the weirdo factor, but sometimes they can just go on and on..
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: dave from knoxville on October 08, 2011, 01:03:09 PM
I like Wally, though I have put off listening to his last legendary call. Wonder if Maron would consent to interviewing him?
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Mr. Spacely on October 09, 2011, 12:51:45 PM
I'm with the first post. The whole thing is genius. Right up there with Spike and vintage LDP calls. The fact, too, that Wally was driving Tom INSANE with the muffled phone was the funniest thing on a show that already featured a top-notch JW call.

I just love the whole notion of this "radio puppet" (brilliant!) who's seething, put-upon, desperate, and a little delusional.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Sarah on October 09, 2011, 01:46:27 PM
I  might love it if his human came off as the opposite.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: whaleplane on October 10, 2011, 12:50:13 AM
I  might love it if his human came off as the opposite.
Exactly.

I'm with the first post. The whole thing is genius. Right up there with Spike and vintage LDP calls. The fact, too, that Wally was driving Tom INSANE with the muffled phone was the funniest thing on a show that already featured a top-notch JW call.

I just love the whole notion of this "radio puppet" (brilliant!) who's seething, put-upon, desperate, and a little delusional.
Those are some harsh words about someone (something?) that is essentially an extension of a put-upon young dude.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Steve of Bloomington on October 10, 2011, 09:36:19 AM

  • Has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium is the radio? What a wonderfully stupid idea.


Well, Charlie McCarthy was a star on old-timey radio but your defense of Wally will hopefully put to rest the Great Feltdown.

I'm a FOWW

...but has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium (now) is Twitter? I think some new ground is being broken.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Crusherkc on October 10, 2011, 12:35:20 PM

  • Has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium is the radio? What a wonderfully stupid idea.


Well, Charlie McCarthy was a star on old-timey radio but your defense of Wally will hopefully put to rest the Great Feltdown.

I'm a FOWW

...but has there ever been a puppet whose primary medium (now) is Twitter? I think some new ground is being broken.

That's a bloody good point
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Sarah on October 10, 2011, 07:24:23 PM
There are so many mythical, animal, vegetable, or mineral mysteries on Twitter, a puppet is barely noteworthy.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: gravy boat on October 11, 2011, 10:24:15 AM
There are so many mythical, animal, vegetable, or mineral mysteries on Twitter, a puppet is barely noteworthy.

Not to mention all the Modern Major-Generals.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Sarah on October 11, 2011, 01:02:33 PM
Precisely.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: JonFromMaplewood on October 17, 2011, 08:45:04 AM
I neglected to mention one very important point in my original post.  While I praise Wally, I know that he could not exist without Tom.

Just as Flavor Flav needed Chuck D to anchor him and make him palatable and give him a reason for existing, Wally needs Tom.




Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Steve of Bloomington on October 17, 2011, 09:25:12 AM
Good point, Dorf Da Golfa.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: MiddleBro on October 17, 2011, 08:40:09 PM
I neglected to mention one very important point in my original post.  While I praise Wally, I know that he could not exist without Tom.

Just as Flavor Flav needed Chuck D to anchor him and make him palatable and give him a reason for existing, Wally needs Tom.

Hey Everyone,
    I've held my tongue on commenting on this thread, for fear of criticisms of being concerned too defensive, etc.  Still, being that this is my creation being discussed, I do feel I have a right to weigh in.  There's so much I could say, but I don't want to get too deep into it with this.  I just wanted to somewhat dispute what I've quoted.  While it's true that Wally may have sat in his bag with not much to do before he became entwined in the grand Best Show universe, and Tom deserves a lot of credit and my eternal gratitude for helping bring him to the masses and giving me a venue to put Wally out there, I do believe what was just said is at least a little bit unfair to me and what I bring with Wally.

He is my original creation and I put a lot of hard work into him.  I'm incredibly proud of what he has become, and it has made me feel great about people actually getting and liking something of my creative output.  Still, even if he would have not gained the fame/infamy that Tom and the show have brought him, I still would like to believe that I could have found some success doing something else with Wally, be it simple children's birthday parties or something like just doing stuff like the YouTube videos he's posted, thus far.  I hope you can all understand where I'm coming from on this point, and not just think I'm being some over-sensitive/defensive whiner.  Thanks for hearing me out, and for all the kind words that have been said in support of my and my foam-and-fleece friend.  I hope we both come back from this ban stronger than before and are able to bring entertainment, smiles, and laughs your way.


   -Zach (Big Z)
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: Kormod on October 17, 2011, 09:44:21 PM

be it simple children's birthday parties or something like just doing stuff like the YouTube videos he's posted, thus far.

   -Zach (Big Z)

I think you're overestimating a child's natural love for puppets. I'm a fan of the puppet, but let's face it -- Wally Wackiman is a neurotic mess who will never entertain a child.

And this isn't meant to be an insult. Wally's great. I just think he's a puppet that's meant for mature audiences only.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: James W on October 18, 2011, 07:32:05 AM
"I am this great, unstable mass of fleece and foam" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ-2kbculaI#ws)
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: buffcoat on October 18, 2011, 03:17:33 PM
It's amazing that John Darnielle says "y'all."  Durham changes you, man.
Title: Re: In praise of the puppet
Post by: MiddleBro on October 20, 2011, 10:57:23 PM

be it simple children's birthday parties or something like just doing stuff like the YouTube videos he's posted, thus far.

   -Zach (Big Z)

I think you're overestimating a child's natural love for puppets. I'm a fan of the puppet, but let's face it -- Wally Wackiman is a neurotic mess who will never entertain a child.

And this isn't meant to be an insult. Wally's great. I just think he's a puppet that's meant for mature audiences only.

Well, I think he kinda came out to be one that worked for adults, but I think that if he stuck to a different side of himself, with the energetic upbeat joy, with the other stuff not needing to come out for the kids, it could work, too.  We did do one show, alongside a monkey puppet of mine, which I didn't build, for a holiday party, so it could work.


   -Zach (Big Z)