FOT Forum
FOT Community => General Discussion => Topic started by: Laurie on July 23, 2006, 10:14:19 AM
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What comic books are you currently reading? I'm really liking Invincible and X-Factor. I must admit, though, I hate these comic book EVENTS Marvel keeps doing. I didn't like feeling pressued to buy books I wouldn't otherwise pick up from the shelf to even browse through. It's a ploy to move substandard books off the shelf.
Speaking of substandard books, Brubaker's Uncanny X-Men is REALLY good.
Also, Done to Death on Markosia is really funny. It lampoons vampire fiction, which is almost universally awful. No, I retract that statement. It's universally awful. Period. That includes novelizations of Buffy the Vampire Slayer and also Terry Pratchett's Carpe Jugulum. Or should I say Jugglerum? I love Discworld (my favorite one is Mort), but the lisping vampires aren't terribly funny.
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I was just going to start a comic book thread in the interest of procrastinating, and discovered this one. Allow me to resurrect it. Wes, who seems to the reigning king of the chat zingers but neither calls nor posts, asked me about comics on the chat. I mostly buy for the writers, though there are some (Geoff Johns, Warren Ellis, Mark Millar) that I only sometimes like.
I'm sick of the big events, too, but am looking forward to Grant Morrison's Final Crisis. Other faves of the moment: Love & Rockets, Y: The Last Man, Buffy, Green Lantern, Action Comics (not crazy about the Bizarro-world story with Eric Powell, but I am digging the Legion storyline), Captain America, Daredevil, Checkmate, Batman (though it's not as good as I was expecting), Brave & Bold (mostly just for the art), Iron Man, Suicide Squad. I'm also totally digging Fantagraphics' complete Peanuts series.
Anyone else?
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Speaking of Fantagraphics, if you can find any of the Friedman Brother's books, I'd recommend them. Especially "Any Similarity to Persons Living or Dead Is Purely Coincidental", the bit about everyone on Earth waking up looking exactly like Earnest Borgine is one of the best things ever.
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I like:
Y- The Last Man (great writing and I think Pia Guerra is a very underrated artist)
Captain America (the books still great even with the main character being dead)
Swamp Thing (I've been re-reading Alan Moore's run. It's still impressive to me after all these years. Which leads me to...)
Hellblazer (my all time favorite character. You can do almost anything with that guy.)
Green Lantern (currently, the only big event story I'm enjoying. It's neat to see how much Ethan Van Sciver's art has evolved. It's like everything he's done before was leading up to his take on GL)
Ex Machina (I'm surprised b how much I've enjoyed that series)
Thor (so far so good. I think it has potential)
DMZ (has it's fair share of interesting moments)
I really want to like, but can't:
World War Hulk (it's like a non-event. Even though it involves some big guns, I have a feeling that it's a "world war" that will ultimately affect no one. I thought that Planet Hulk went on WAAAAAAYYYY too long also)
The Boys (Every now and the Garth Ennis gets a little too Garth Ennis. Does that make sense? I really like his work, but sometimes he is predictably "shocking and over the top" and it kinda looses the effect for me.)
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Favorites are: Preacher, Strangers In Paradise, Bone, Walking Dead & The Boys (though I haven't been keeping up with those two.)
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(http://www.raintaxi.com/online/2000winter/images/cerebus.jpg)
the last comic I'll ever love.
Give the man his props!
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I really want to like, but can't:
World War Hulk (it's like a non-event. Even though it involves some big guns, I have a feeling that it's a "world war" that will ultimately affect no one. I thought that Planet Hulk went on WAAAAAAYYYY too long also)
The Boys (Every now and the Garth Ennis gets a little too Garth Ennis. Does that make sense? I really like his work, but sometimes he is predictably "shocking and over the top" and it kinda looses the effect for me.)
Yes indeed. I really like Greg Pak in general, and I enjoyed the Planet Hulk storyline, but it's like: all of Civil War was sparked by Stamford, CT getting blown up, but then Hulk destroys Manhattan and everyone just sort of shrugs and goes back to the Skrulls, Mutants, Symbiotes, Aunt May, or whatever they have going on?
And I know everyone is supposed to love Ennis, but I really do think he descends into self-parody more often than not...
(http://www.raintaxi.com/online/2000winter/images/cerebus.jpg)
the last comic I'll ever love.
Give the man his props!
I dunno, Ason, I'm with Tom on this one. I wound up with enormous stacks of Cerebus comics from the 2-3 years I tried to like it (and some of the art is great, but isn't that all his inker?), but it just dragged on, and Sim is such a misogynist loonball - not that I think any artist's crazy personal beliefs are necessarily relevant, but in this case it did seem to inform his work.
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(http://www.raintaxi.com/online/2000winter/images/cerebus.jpg)
the last comic I'll ever love.
Give the man his props!
I dunno, Ason, I'm with Tom on this one. I wound up with enormous stacks of Cerebus comics from the 2-3 years I tried to like it (and some of the art is great, but isn't that all his inker?), but it just dragged on, and Sim is such a misogynist loonball - not that I think any artist's crazy personal beliefs are necessarily relevant, but in this case it did seem to inform his work.
The inker Gerhard did mostly the backgrounds and some lettering. Cerebus is really Dave Sim's baby and the evolution of the actually artwork is breath taking, not to mention how he constantly pushed forward on the technical aspects of paneling, space....sound (I know).
It's all about how you frame things I guess because I don't think of it as dragging on I think of the story as epic and singular.
Of course his eccentricities coloured his work, when the art is true it always does. I don't agree with his whole "male light/female void" thesis but man, if anybody takes the time to read that passage it shows what a brilliant, powerful mind was at work. It is a dense polemic for any form literature.
For a guy that is such a "misogynist" he created some compelling female characters....much more so than big boobed sex pot caricatures in mainstream fare.
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Keeping up with comic books is too expensive. But, I was able to read the entire Civil War event and that was pretty cool. I understand that people who are regular readers might be annoyed by the fact they have to go buy comics they don't normally buy. For me, it was a fun way to read about other comic book heroes other than Spiderman and Batman.
Other than that I stick to Batman, American Splendor and graphic novels...and Sandman. Sandman is the best. Pretty standard fare for me.
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Ok I read Cerebus back in the good old funny days. Then it got to the point of sheer boredom and just waited for those phone book collections. Actually after Guys then it really slowed down and I just gave up.
Well for those waiting for the new League of Extraordinary Gentlemen - Don't get your hopes up. I was told from a pal of mine its a major let down
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I like:
Y- The Last Man (great writing and I think Pia Guerra is a very underrated artist)
Captain America (the books still great even with the main character being dead)
Swamp Thing (I've been re-reading Alan Moore's run. It's still impressive to me after all these years. Which leads me to...)
Hellblazer (my all time favorite character. You can do almost anything with that guy.)
Green Lantern (currently, the only big event story I'm enjoying. It's neat to see how much Ethan Van Sciver's art has evolved. It's like everything he's done before was leading up to his take on GL)
Ex Machina (I'm surprised b how much I've enjoyed that series)
Thor (so far so good. I think it has potential)
DMZ (has it's fair share of interesting moments)
I really want to like, but can't:
World War Hulk (it's like a non-event. Even though it involves some big guns, I have a feeling that it's a "world war" that will ultimately affect no one. I thought that Planet Hulk went on WAAAAAAYYYY too long also)
The Boys (Every now and the Garth Ennis gets a little too Garth Ennis. Does that make sense? I really like his work, but sometimes he is predictably "shocking and over the top" and it kinda looses the effect for me.)
I totally argee with you on Ennis. As much as I love Preacher it was pretty heavy on the gratutious shock value. It might be a little more forgivable in Preacher's case as I believe it was one of the first Vertigo titles and both the writer and the publisher wanted to show how "adult" they could be. In The Boys the sex, violence and general depravity doesn't seem to have much of a point other than Ennis skewering traditional superhero archetypes. However, the "superheroes that aren't so righteous and squeaky clean" thing has been done to death. It's practically the default mode for mainstream comics nowadays. All this this would be fine if The Boys looked half as good or has a story anywhere near as involving as Preacher. I'm about ready to give up on it. I'll give it one more story arc.
I actually gave both Brain K Vaughn titles (Ex Machina and Y: The Last Man) you mentioned a shot but gave up on both after around 20 issues. Both started really strong (Y, in particular, had a brilliant first issue) but as soon as I realized that neither of the big questions raised in early issues were getting answered anytime soon I lost interest. I understand that there's something to be said for the slow burn but none of the story tangents Vaughn went on moved me all that much.
Stuff I do like:
Ed Brubaker's run on Daredevil and his pulp crime comic Criminal. I became a fan of the Brube from this work on Gotham Central. I followed him over to Marvel and thus far have not been dissapointed. Both books are fantastic. I took a look his work Iron First (which I thought was decent) but I haven't read any of his Captain America yet. I'm a little weary that I'll have to keep up wih everything else going on in the Marvel universe to comprehend it. Is this the case?
Robert Kirkman's Walking Dead and Invincible. Walking Dead has the potential to be one of the great horror comics of all time, even if the series has hit a bit of a lull of late. I just like Invincible's light, Silver Age-influenced tone and wacky sci-fi elements. It's refreshing to read a superhero book that's not "grim and gritty" or self-important and that you don't need a Ph.D. in continuity to follow.
Also enjoying:
All Star Superman
Any issue of Detective Comics Paul Dini writes. (Though that's beginning get sucked into the "Countdown" storyline)
Peter Bagge's just completed Apocalypse Nerd (I'm a big Bagge fan)
Omega The Unknown (Dug the first 2 issues)
Crossing Midnight (thanks Laurie!)
Also just got into Kurt Busiek's Astro City and I'm slowly making my way through the TPBs.
Looking forward to the new League of Extraordinary Gentleman but I'll heed Bruce's advice and try not to set my expectations too high.
I would also like to highly recommend Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics. An essential read for any fan of the medium.
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I actually gave both Brain K Vaughn titles (Ex Machina and Y: The Last Man) you mentioned a shot but gave up on both after around 20 issues. Both started really strong (Y, in particular, had a brilliant first issue) but as soon as I realized that neither of the big questions raised in early issues were getting answered anytime soon I lost interest
You might want to catch up on Y-The Last Man. There's only one issue left in the series, and things have been pretty exciting in the closing.
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All-Star Superman is the only comic I buy in single issues. It's like prozac in glossy-page form. Anyone read the one that just came out. The ending was a bit contrived but it's still my fav book right now by leaps and bounds (tee hee).
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All-Star Superman is good. All-Suck Batman & Robin is bad. Will someone please shoot Frank Miller for me? Thanks!
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Oh, god, Frank Miller, yeah. Will someone please put him out of our misery? I mean, Batman vs. Al-Qaeda? Really?
And that shitty ending to the Martha Washington saga, the last good thing Miller ever did, was just tragic. So, after this (occasionally ham-fisted but often sharp) satire in which bureaucracy, war, factionalism, corruption, and environmental devastation basically ended the American empire, and then there was some sort of outer space robot thing, some thinly disguised stand-ins for Muslim terrorists managed to destroy the utopia that Washington and her allies created? I feel like anyone who thinks Christopher Hitchens' political transformation is extreme and/or regrettable should read Frank Miller's comics over the last 10 years or so.
And Batman & Robin, I haven't been anywhere near that thing. I wouldn't Byrne-steal it with John Byrne's dick.
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To this day, "The Killing Joke" is my favorite Batman story. Alan Moore considers the story "clunky" in retrospect, but I love it. That's another difference between Alan Moore and Frank Miller, aside form the whole talent thing -- you think Miller ever looks back at a story and thinks, "Yeah, that was kind of horrible"?
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To me this joke made me laugh harder then anything in last nights Simpsons
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a19/minder125/watchmen.jpg)
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To this day, "The Killing Joke" is my favorite Batman story. Alan Moore considers the story "clunky" in retrospect, but I love it. That's another difference between Alan Moore and Frank Miller, aside form the whole talent thing -- you think Miller ever looks back at a story and thinks, "Yeah, that was kind of horrible"?
I know you're not a Miller fan, which is quite understandable. I do like Dark Knight Returns and (especially) Batman: Year One but, boy, are you ever right about All Star Batman and Robin. That thing is at least 10 different kinds of awful.
I've heard Alan Moore disparage The Killing Joke as well. I think the gist of his gripe was that it was just a story about Batman and the Joker, there was no "greater meaning" or something to that effect. This may well be true but it's a great Batman story. It's probably the best statement on the relationship between Batman and the Joker. It's a shame that Moore well probably again never write stories for liscensed characters because he's probably better at it than anyone else.
That Simpsons gag last night was hilarious. I actually thought the entire episode was the best of the season thus far. However, that just might be my comic book geekiness talking.
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I've heard Alan Moore disparage The Killing Joke as well. I think the gist of his gripe was that it was just a story about Batman and the Joker, there was no "greater meaning" or something to that effect. This may well be true but it's a great Batman story. It's probably the best statement on the relationship between Batman and the Joker. It's a shame that Moore well probably again never write stories for liscensed characters because he's probably better at it than anyone else.
I know, Alan Moore is the best. He even made me love Superman. I remember when the Justice League cartoon adapted the Alan Moore story from Superman Annual #11. I loved it so much that I tracked down said issue, and it made me cry. Seriously. He's the best.
It's a shame about all of the disputes he's had. He does seem a tad anal, but I guess I would be royally pissed and nitpick over everything if they ruined something I made. Did you guys see League of Extraordinary Gentlemen? Enough said.
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I've heard Alan Moore disparage The Killing Joke as well. I think the gist of his gripe was that it was just a story about Batman and the Joker, there was no "greater meaning" or something to that effect. This may well be true but it's a great Batman story. It's probably the best statement on the relationship between Batman and the Joker. It's a shame that Moore well probably again never write stories for liscensed characters because he's probably better at it than anyone else.
I know, Alan Moore is the best. He even made me love Superman. I remember when the Justice League cartoon adapted the Alan Moore story from Superman Annual #11. I loved it so much that I tracked down said issue, and it made me cry. Seriously. He's the best.
It's a shame about all of the disputes he's had. He does seem a tad anal, but I guess I would be royally pissed and nitpick over everything if they ruined something I made. Did you guys see League of Extraordinary Gentlemen? Enough said.
OK, here is me tossing a stink-bomb into the room: I love Moore's work, especially his 80s stuff, and I think The Killing Joke still holds up. But I also hold that he's nowhere near the literary genius that his fans make him out to be. Watchmen is structurally brilliant, and better than most other superhero comics by an order of magnitude, but it's also filled with ham-fisted symbolism, easy melodrama, and simplistic politics. Ditto for V For Vendetta, which I loved when DC published it in the late 80s, but seems a little shallow today. And I find his more recent work a mixed bag - From Hell and LOEG were great reads, but his ABC stuff seemed like he was phoning it in.
Anyway, Moore's work blew my mind when I was a teenager, and acted as sort of a gateway drug to stuff like Borges or Pynchon, so I wouldn't want to deny anyone else that experience. And I wouldn't think of comparing him to Frank Miller. But I think he's reflexively elevated to godlike status, when really (by his own admission), he's a lot closer to Stephen King than James Joyce - a really good genre writer. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Proceed to eviscerate me now.
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That's another difference between Alan Moore John Astin and Frank Miller Gorshin, aside form the whole talent thing -- you think Miller Gorshin ever looks back at a story an episode and thinks, "Yeah, that was kind of horrible I think I overplayed that laugh"?
Reworked!
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The best Batman I've ever read is Gotham By Gaslight.
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At the risk of turning this into the Alan Moore thread, I have to say that I really liked "Tom Strong". That book had a lot of great talent in the art department and was one of the most fun comics I've ever read. I also enjoyed "Top Ten" and (know that I think about it) almost everything I ever read from his America's Best Comics company.
Side-note: I can't shake the feeling that I would not enjoy meeting and talking to Alan Moore.
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At the risk of turning this into the Alan Moore thread, I have to say that I really liked "Tom Strong". That book had a lot of great talent in the art department and was one of the most fun comics I've ever read. I also enjoyed "Top Ten" and (know that I think about it) almost everything I ever read from his America's Best Comics company.
Side-note: I can't shake the feeling that I would not enjoy meeting and talking to Alan Moore.
Tom Strong to me was just Alan Moore doing a very blatant Doc Savage tribute. Also I've seen Moore in a recent Documentary about Steve Ditko and he came off actually very likable.
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Side-note: I can't shake the feeling that I would not enjoy meeting and talking to Alan Moore.
Whereas Warren Ellis is delightful. No, really, he's quite personable! We're on each others' friends list.
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Speaking of Warren Ellis, does anyone have any recommendations of his work? I know that I've read some of his stuff, but aside from a few issues of Hellblazer I can't recall what it was. He's a writer that continually gets high praise and I'd like to see what the fuss is about.
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Speaking of Warren Ellis, does anyone have any recommendations of his work? I know that I've read some of his stuff, but aside from a few issues of Hellblazer I can't recall what it was. He's a writer that continually gets high praise and I'd like to see what the fuss is about.
He's one of those guys I don't always like, but he's got some pretty good stuff. His Stormwatch and Authority are pretty fun, and I'm liking his Thunderbolts comic. I just don't like when he tries to be wacky.
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Im considering picking up that Ed Brubaker's Captain America Omnibus. I havent ever followed that book. Is it easy to pick up or will I drown in half a century of backstory? How is it overall?
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Im considering picking up that Ed Brubaker's Captain America Omnibus. I havent ever followed that book. Is it easy to pick up or will I drown in half a century of backstory? How is it overall?
Nah, You'll be fine. I like that book. Hope you will too.
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Im considering picking up that Ed Brubaker's Captain America Omnibus. I havent ever followed that book. Is it easy to pick up or will I drown in half a century of backstory? How is it overall?
I second this. I held out for a while, but there's just enough realism and spy-novel intrigue to keep it interesting. I'd say it contained the best of the Civil War-related crossovers by far.
Nah, You'll be fine. I like that book. Hope you will too.
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You'd think I'd learn my lesson about ressurecting old threads but...
(http://www.newsarama.com/DBPro/FOB/FOBpinupColor.jpg)
Fall Out Boy is coming to comics. It will be drawn by people who don't know anything about music or how to hold a guitar. The first issue will apparently be Fall Out Boy vs. the Forrest of Haunted USB Cables.
Crossovers with bands and comics are nothing new but some recent developments have gone TOO FAR. Do we really need a collection of comics based on Tori Amos songs? Et tu, Hope Larson?
Also is anyone reading Scott Pilgrim? Possibly the most entertaining comic I've ever read.
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Do we really need a collection of comics based on Tori Amos songs? Et tu, Neil Gaiman?
Fixed!
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Cheers.
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The inker Gerhard did mostly the backgrounds and some lettering. Cerebus is really Dave Sim's baby and the evolution of the actually artwork is breath taking, not to mention how he constantly pushed forward on the technical aspects of paneling, space....sound (I know).
It's all about how you frame things I guess because I don't think of it as dragging on I think of the story as epic and singular.
Of course his eccentricities coloured his work, when the art is true it always does. I don't agree with his whole "male light/female void" thesis but man, if anybody takes the time to read that passage it shows what a brilliant, powerful mind was at work. It is a dense polemic for any form literature.
For a guy that is such a "misogynist" he created some compelling female characters....much more so than big boobed sex pot caricatures in mainstream fare.
Am I wrong in thinking that Cerebus is basically the comic book equivalent of Frank Zappa? A horrible self-sustaining loop that some people seem to get stuck in.
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Somewhere on the internets, Douglas Wolk of Reading Comics recently made a spirited defense of Cerebus that - while it will not convince me to read it - makes me understand why people like it. I actually did follow it for a while in the late 80s/early 90s, but gave up on it.
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The inker Gerhard did mostly the backgrounds and some lettering. Cerebus is really Dave Sim's baby and the evolution of the actually artwork is breath taking, not to mention how he constantly pushed forward on the technical aspects of paneling, space....sound (I know).
It's all about how you frame things I guess because I don't think of it as dragging on I think of the story as epic and singular.
Of course his eccentricities coloured his work, when the art is true it always does. I don't agree with his whole "male light/female void" thesis but man, if anybody takes the time to read that passage it shows what a brilliant, powerful mind was at work. It is a dense polemic for any form literature.
For a guy that is such a "misogynist" he created some compelling female characters....much more so than big boobed sex pot caricatures in mainstream fare.
Am I wrong in thinking that Cerebus is basically the comic book equivalent of Frank Zappa? A horrible self-sustaining loop that some people seem to get stuck in.
I'm a big Zappa fan. Maybe it's a math thing.
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I've been catching up on a lot of stuff that is pretty much standard and universally appreciated, like Eightball (In particular, Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron) and Preacher.
I've read some All-Star Superman, which I liked, as well as Craig Thompson (late, I know. I might as well say I liked this CD called Lovage) and other indie-comixxixix. I like Grant Morrison, and after reading an interview concerning his run on Batman, my interest is really piqued.
Is it something worth looking into? On top of the other million titles I need to read. Like, uh, Madman. And other stuff.
The interview - http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=147734
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I love Morrison but his Batman has not been so hot so far. I like it in theory - the sexy late 60s/early 70s Batman, with a sense of humor, sort of a palliative to the grim n' gritty post Dark Knight stuff - but it seems a little rushed. Maybe it's just that the current artist isn't a great storyteller. I'm pretty psyched for Final Crisis, though.
What is this Lovage of which you speak?
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Do you mean the Mike Patton/Jennifer Charles/Dan the Automator/Kid Koala project? I got into it because I love Jennifer Charles. I also love her collaborations with John Zorn and the Ladino stuff she's done on Zorn's Tzadik label. I'm a Tzadik apologist. The half-Jew in me can't resist it.
Wow! That was off topic, no?
On topic: The last issue of Y: The Last Man made me cry really hard. The part with Ampersand? Oh man. :'(
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I love Morrison but his Batman has not been so hot so far. I like it in theory - the sexy late 60s/early 70s Batman, with a sense of humor, sort of a palliative to the grim n' gritty post Dark Knight stuff - but it seems a little rushed. Maybe it's just that the current artist isn't a great storyteller. I'm pretty psyched for Final Crisis, though.
[/quote
I might like his run on Batman more if it wasn't being published at the same time as All Star Superman, which makes everything else in the universe pales in comparison. I liked the Batman and Son collection but it's just nowhere near the achievement that is Morrison's ASS (I feel dirty now).
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On topic: The last issue of Y: The Last Man made me cry really hard. The part with Ampersand? Oh man. :'(
Don't spoil it!!!
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On topic: The last issue of Y: The Last Man made me cry really hard. The part with Ampersand? Oh man. :'(
Don't spoil it!!!
what's with everyone loving this comic?
am I the only one who thinks it's pretty poorly written and on the whole, really chauvinistic
maybe I'm just disappointed because it's nowhere near as good as Runaways
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Of the Brian K Vaughan stuff I've read, I think "Y" is the champion. I think it works best when read in collected volumes instead of single issues. I tried to hop on board when it first came out, but I couldn't hang out every month waiting on the next bit. I love the book in trade paper back form.
I think that Pia Guerra is a super underrated artist. I hope she lands a great gig after "Y".
also, "Runaways" caught me by suprise. I really expected to not like that book at all...but it's pretty darn good.
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Why do you think it's chauvinistic, Colin? I love BKV's writing generally, though I don't think I agree with much of his politics (a conclusion I arrived at more from Ex-Machina than Y).
Gagneaux, I generally agree, though I love the cliffhangers.
Laurie, yes, that was so fucking sad. Pia Guerra draws one hell of a (SPOILER) capuchin money.
By the way, this month's Morrison Batman has been my favorite in a while.
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Awgh. Not much to add, except that I read every issue of Y: The Last Man, and yeah, without spoilering or anything, I thought it was really fantastic. Exciting and well researched. It kind of seemed like the offspring of Preacher in a lot of ways, which I'm sure isn't a coincidence.
Thanks to these magical tax returns, my girlfriend and I* ordered a pretty large stock of comics on amazon.
Amongst the heap:
Black Hole, Like a Velvet Glove Cast In Iron, Fables Vol. 1, Summer Blonde, Maggie the Mechanic (Love and Rockets) and some other stuff.
Any consensus?
*I know it's a hindrance to reference a significant other in an internet anecdote, when it seems unnecessary to do so, but truth be told, it's her tax return I'm parasiting.
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Velvet Glove will give you nightmares. For that matter, Black Hole probably will too. I love all of L&R, but many friends who have started with Maggie the Mechanic it say they don't get what the big deal is - personally, I love it, but many prefer the more realistic later Locas stories, like The Death of Speedy.
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I don't read comics very often. I'm not against them by any means, I just don't get too caught up in them very often... UNTIL a friend handed me a copy of DMZ. This is most intelligent and well-rendered comic I've read in a while. If there is anything that speaks to current events and my NYC-bred paranoia, it's this.
This same gentlemen also handed me a copy of Y and I thought it was the dumbest thing I'd ever read. I admit, I haven't read the entire series yet, so if I do I'm completely prepared to eat my words if it sneaks back in the 9th inning and redeems itself. I WANT it to redeem itself.
The premise is brilliant and it builds the tension well early on, but I just don't believe the motivation for any of the characters. I can't suspend my disbelief. I know it's just a comic book, but it's characters don't make sense in their own world, or he's just not taking the time and rushing to the action.
I expressed my opinion to the said gentleman who loaned it to me and he's withholding the rest of the series. This might be a beginning of a tantrum. Or maybe he's protecting me! As if at the end of the series there will be a guy who is behind the whole plot and he'll look like me, and wouldn't that REALLY shake my soda! I went into hock over DMZ, but I'm not inclined to shill for Y. I may never know.
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The thing I liked about DMZ is that it basically turns New York City into present-day Baghdad. It's interesting to see that horrible mess transplanted to home. There's no doubt that DMZ has a political edge (I don't see any consistent overwhelming dogma to it though), but it can also be enjoyed outside of that element.
..and the artwork is very gorgeous.
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Seriously!
It throws the ideology aside and just deals with the people who have to live in the mess created by people who think they have the greater good in mind. DMZ explores the everyday details of trying to survive in a warzone and tries to restore the dignity of people who have lost it to forces that are totally out of their control.
It's something that Americans have never had to deal with and could use a little empathy towards.
I can't wait see the movie movie-adaption that ruins this. I'm thinking Matt Daemon as the lead.
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Invincible Presents: Atom Eve #2 by friends Benito Cereno and Nate Bellegarde came to be today. Buy if you want a good comic, and if you want to see a 14 year-old incarnate of young Satchmo as the villain. (You should probably get issue one too).
I'm on my way to reading DMZ, finishing Ex Machina and some other stuff. Also, I enjoyed Jeff Smith's RASL #1.
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CAREFUL! DMX is going to ruin you for other comics!
Yesterday I was flipping through my Superman #1, with my little felt gloves on to protect this trillion dollar asset... and I chucked it across the room and shouted, "YOU BE MORE LIKE DMZ!"
Investment ruined.
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There's a pretty funny Sin City parody in the latest HOTWIRE (Fantagraphics). It's called Sin Shitty. Loved it.
You know, I'm actually loving HOTWIRE. There are a few things in there that verge on unreadable and have no redeeming qualities whatsoever, but there's a lot of wonderful stuff to be found in the second volume here. "Zombie Justice" by Matti Hagelberg and "A Massive Stroke of Bad Luck" by Jonathan Rosen were worth the price of admission. I'm also enamored by Mary Fleener's cubist variations on Our Lady of Guadalupe imagery and Mark Dean Veca's wallpapery drawings (http://www.markdeanveca.com/drawTh.html). I would paper an entire room in his stuff if it were commercially available. I love it. Colette (http://www.colette.fr/), get on that shit.
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I picked up DMZ, thought it was OK - kinda like 100 Bullets in execution, if not concept. I might stick with it for a little while, but I wasn't floored by it.
Laurie, isn't that pretty much the way of comic anthologies? Some good stuff, lots of OK stuff, about a fifth of it a total waste of trees.
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I guess so. I do know where I'm buying my next paintings, though, so... Score?
Jason, did you pick up the latest issue of DMZ, or the first volume? If it was the former, I recommend checking out the latter. My favorite issue was number 4. I also love #25. I think Mr. Wilson is a great character.
I like 100 Bullets, but I think it's better to read it in TPB-form. It isn't easy following the plot on a bi-monthly basis. By the time two months or more have passed, I've already forgotten what happened in the last issue. Well, that's a bit of an exaggeration, but you get what I'm saying. It was just more entertaining reading four trades in one shot then waiting two months for the next 24 pages or whatever.
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I'd never recommend 100 Bullets in monthly format. Even remembering what happened between the TPB's when they come out can be kinda tricky. It is a good book though.
Marvel seems to mostly be putting out crap lately. I do like The Twelve. But that's probably because it's not in the same continuity as the rest of the Marvel U. They were really doing well for a few years, putting out good stuff. But a couple years ago when they decided to have "events" happening across every book one after the other? I tuned out. But The Twelve is great. I'm also really enjoying Kick-Ass so far.
DC-wise it's gotten pretty grim lately too, with all the "event" bullshit. I still pick up the Fables stuff. A few other random things. All Star Superman is great, as is almost everything Morrison does (his recent Batman stuff is lacking though). And I'm going to go out a limb and defend All-Star Batman, because it's so ridiculous.
I will buy anything Mignolla or Hellboy-related. It is all consistently great.
I also love anything by Dan Clowes, Chris Ware, Jason, Johnny Ryan, and a handful of other "alternative" comics.
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Laurie - I should probably check out a DMZ trade. Maybe I'll leaf through it at Barnes & Noble if I ever have any time to kill ever again. I loved 100 Bullets at first, then got really bored by the whole conspiracy thing. Maybe there was a good payoff, but I couldn't wait.
Orangewhip - Ditto on Morrison. I'm looking forward to Final Crisis and hoping it doesn't fall apart at the end. Re. Marvel: I'm with Patton Oswalt in thinking Ed Brubaker is awesome. Captain America and Daredevil are must-reads for me each month. Iron Man (the regular title) has also been pretty good lately. Also, I'm not ready to drop it just yet, but I'm starting to think that Mark Millar's Fantastic Four SUCKS. So far it reads like a middle-aged Scottish guy watching a lot of Fox programming and mistaking it for hipness, then trying to graft that onto a fucking superhero comic book.
I also like the alt-comix. Johnny Ryan makes me laff but he also makes me a little sick and depressed after a while - the stuff's actually better in single issues.
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i was really enjoying Brubakers Daredevil and Cap. stuff, but then it got pulled into all the event stuff and I got turned off. Actually, I kinda dropped out of Daredevil during that story where he is in France. I kinda plan on catching up with TPB's eventually.
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Oh, Grote, drop the FF already. I did months ago, and I've never been happier.
I also dropped ALL of the Spider-Man books during the One More Delay bullshit. Seriously, the second One More Day issue dropped, and I was so over it. I didn't care what happened to Aunt May anymore. Boring. I still read Ultimate Spider-Man, though. I actually like Bendis. Is that an unpopular opinion to have?
I've heard people bitching about how The New Avengers has never looked more beautiful (true, you can NEVER go wrong with David Mack), but the writing is just terrible blah blah blah. I disagree. I think Bendis is a fine writer, and he's shown that he can drop the banter-y schtick when the story calls for a more serious tone. Oh man. That Hawkeye/Scarlet Witch story was beautiful -- both the writing and David Mack's gorgeous art. I really loved it.
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A lot of people with good taste keep telling me how great Bendis is, so you're not alone, but I honestly don't get it. I really have tried.
OK, I'm dropping the FF. I guess I'll have to face the fact that it will never be good again.
And I wouldn't read any of that One More day garbage with... I don't know, some other nerd's eyes. I'll try to come up with a better metaphor.
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I recently finished reading Benids and Alex Maleev's run on Daredevil after reading about in Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics and I have to say I was absolutely blown away. Though I've not read any of his other work yet (aside from his autobio quickie Fortune and Glory) I am looking forward to further examining his body of work so you can count me as a fan. I was considering picking up this week's Secret Invasion debut but that sort of "event" comic seems far to bogged down in continuity for me to get a grip on it.
I've been digging Brubaker's stuff as well. His Daredevil with Michael Lark and Criminal with Sean Phillips are two of the only "floppies" I pick up whenever they come out. I haven't read any of his Captain America stuff yet but everyone tells me it's fantastic. I first got turned on the Brube via Gotham Central (also with Michael Lark) which was canceled due to poor sales but the trades are well worth picking up.
I tried to get into DMZ. I picked up the first trade but it wasn't really to my liking. Oh well. I do have to compliment Laurie once again on recommending Crossing Midnight to me. I'm really loving it.
Anyone read Walking Dead? The last issue was pretty brutal (emotionally, not artistically). Without giving away any spoilers I'll say that after opening with what I perceived as a cop out, the story then took a really dark turn. I can't tell if it's legitimately good storytelling or easy shock value. Either way I'm compelled.
I also picked up the latest American Splendor yesterday. If anything it's gotten more mundane. It's a shame because for the first time Pekar is regularly working with top artists but as Tom said he's just run out of story. The new issue is divided between Harvey's cranky old man stories and reminisces about the past that don't go anywhere. I think Pekar is slowly turning into Grandpa Simpson.
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Anyone read Walking Dead? The last issue was pretty brutal (emotionally, not artistically). Without giving away any spoilers I'll say that after opening with what I perceived as a cop out, the story then took a really dark turn. I can't tell if it's legitimately good storytelling or easy shock value. Either way I'm compelled.
I am ready to drop this almost every month but after the latest issue, I'm sticking around for a bit. I knew some shit was going to go down but wasn't expecting such a dark turn. It's almost like the book got a reboot with that issue and I am really curious to see where things go, at least for a few more issues.
Doctor Sleepless has been really good and I liked Secret Invasion 1.
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I'm convinced that David Lapham is a virgin after skimming through his latest book. I forget what it's called.
Oh man, he's just trying way too hard to be hip, and it's not working out at all. It's like he invented a time machine just to go back to 1994. BO-RING.
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I'm convinced that David Lapham is a virgin after skimming through his latest book. I forget what it's called.
If it was Young Liars, I agree on all counts.
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That's the one!!
I just looked up his age on Wikipedia. He's not 15 years old. :o :o :o
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I gave Fables a shot last year and read the first 3 tpbs. I kinda didn't see anything above "good" about it. Is it a really "slow burn"? Should I give it another shot?
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I would. I really love Fables, personally.
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I thought I'd give Dave Sim's new book, Glamourpuss, a try. I've never read Cerebus, but it's obviously well-liked and critically acclaimed and all that crap. Seriously, though, if it's as boring as this piece of shit, I don't think I'll ever wade through 6000 pages of Cerebus.
I'm only nine pages in, and I'm already fatigued. It's just pictures this douchebag self-admittedly traces from old comic strips and current fashion magazines. The text is all meta, no plot -- he's just talking about tracing and cross-hatching and shit. SO BORING.
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I thought I'd give Dave Sim's new book, Glamourpuss, a try. I've never read Cerebus, but it's obviously well-liked and critically acclaimed and all that crap. Seriously, though, if it's as boring as this piece of shit, I don't think I'll ever wade through 6000 pages of Cerebus.
I'm only nine pages in, and I'm already fatigued. It's just pictures this douchebag self-admittedly traces from old comic strips and current fashion magazines. The text is all meta, no plot -- he's just talking about tracing and cross-hatching and shit. SO BORING.
Don't feel bad Laurie I gave up on Cerebus a long time before it finished it got really bad once he left the bar setting (Guys)
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I just read Paul Goes Fishing by Michel Rabagliati. I shed a tear. Then my wife read it, and lost her shit. Anyhow, easily one of the best books (comic or regular) that I've read in ages.
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I read that, too! I also cried. :'(
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I just finished Warren Ellis' novel "Crooked Little Vein." I don't recommend it. Gross for the sake of gross, and no point to it other then "stay away from my rights, you stupid government!" I have to pretend that I liked it for my friend because I've been harshing his tastes a little too much lately.
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I just finished Warren Ellis' novel "Crooked Little Vein." I don't recommend it. Gross for the sake of gross, and no point to it other then "stay away from my rights, you stupid government!" I have to pretend that I liked it for my friend because I've been harshing his tastes a little too much lately.
Are you a fan of his other stuff? Transmetropolitan is one of my favorite series of all time, so I was definitely interested in his novel. How gross was it? Garth Ennis gross or 2G1C gross?
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Good lord, I just looked up 2G1C. This is around the 2G1C realm.
I liked Transmetropolitan also. Crooked Little Vein had one part that skeeved me out so badly I almost tossed the book out. It would have made a better graphic novel I suppose, but I found it really pandering.
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Good lord, I just looked up 2G1C. This is around the 2G1C realm.
I liked Transmetropolitan also. Crooked Little Vein had one part that skeeved me out so badly I almost tossed the book out. It would have made a better graphic novel I suppose, but I found it really pandering.
Which part? There are quite a few to choose from but my guess is that it was the testicle thing. That kind of skeeved me.
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what comic book should I start out with? I haven't read any in a long time and I'm looking for something that's entertaining, not creepy, and not too deep.
answer that.
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what comic book should I start out with? I haven't read any in a long time and I'm looking for something that's entertaining, not totally tubular, and not too deep.
answer that.
Strangers In Paradise
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In the area of easily available trade paperbacks, I'd vote for Y: The Last Man (start from the beginning), Love & Rockets, most of the (non-Kevin Smith) Daredevil stuff collected in trade is pretty good, though the Bendis/Maleev stuff should be read in order, most of the Grant Morrison JLA, Animal Man, Doom Patrol, Hate, Eightball, Black Hole.
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what about Thor?
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what comic book should I start out with? I haven't read any in a long time and I'm looking for something that's entertaining, not totally tubular, and not too deep.
answer that.
Superhero wise, I think New Avengers has been great from the start. I second the non-Kevin Smith Daredevil issues, Green Lantern has been decent, Kick Ass and Black Summer have been interesting...All Star Superman.
Non-superhero stuff I have been enjoying: DMZ, Gravel, Doktor Sleepless, Crecy, Dan Dare, Garth Ennis' Punisher, Fell, and some others I can't recall right now.
oh, I guess I am a little queer for Warren Ellis stuff.
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I have been reading X-Force/X-Statix recently and I enjoy it a lot. I read a few issues of Runaways, not so much...
Also, kind of embarrasingly, Death Note. I know, but I like it.
Soon, I am going to start - Immortal Iron Fist, All-Star Superman, The Umbrella Academy, Fables, Watchmen, Swamp Thing (Alan Moore's run), V for Vendetta and Brought to Light.
Black Hole was really great, Skim by Mariko and Jillian Tamaki was great, Ice Haven and Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron were great! (I already read both years ago, but I was like 15 at the time, so it doesn't count).
Okay. (I'm also preparing a pitch for Oni Press, how bout it).
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Which part? There are quite a few to choose from but my guess is that it was the testicle thing. That kind of skeeved me.
Ack, yes. The testicle thing.
I did like asking my friend if he wants to get 'big nuts' with me this weekend. It made his squirm, the bastard.
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Black Hole was really great, Skim by Mariko and Jillian Tamaki was great, Ice Haven and Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron were great! (I already read both years ago, but I was like 15 at the time, so it doesn't count).
I second Black Hole, or anything by Dan Clowes as a first comic book for a grown-up. I wouldn't recommend any superhero stuff whatsoever - unless you got into it as a kid and have that nostalgia factor, it's pretty dumb. (Though, obviously, I do love a lot of it).
This is a golden age for good, sophisticated comics.
And also a good time, from what I hear, for genre junk that's labelled "For Mature Readers" but is actually mostly appropriate for 15 year olds. Anytime I try to read that Vertigo-type stuff I'm left really cold. I feel like I'm watching bad tv. Or maybe so-so tv.
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are there any trrent stes where I could check out these potential comics to see which I want to spent my cash on?
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are there any trrent stes where I could check out these potential comics to see which I want to spent my cash on?
Demonoid
Also Immortal Iron Fist just rules, but I grew up reading the original and then the team up with Luke Cage
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Ack, yes. The testicle thing.
I did like asking my friend if he wants to get 'big nuts' with me this weekend. It made his squirm, the bastard.
Oddly, if the opportunity presented itself, I'd probably do it just for the experience. As long as I can get past putting an IV in my scotum, I think I could do it.
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Ack, yes. The testicle thing.
I did like asking my friend if he wants to get 'big nuts' with me this weekend. It made his squirm, the bastard.
Anybody want to transcribe or describe the scene so we know what you're talking about?
Oddly, if the opportunity presented itself, I'd probably do it just for the experience. As long as I can get past putting an IV in my scotum, I think I could do it.
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Ack, yes. The testicle thing.
I did like asking my friend if he wants to get 'big nuts' with me this weekend. It made his squirm, the bastard.
Anybody want to transcribe or describe the scene so we know what you're talking about?
Oddly, if the opportunity presented itself, I'd probably do it just for the experience. As long as I can get past putting an IV in my scotum, I think I could do it.
In short, a chat with a bodybuilder leads to a session in which the protangonist's testicles are shot full of a saline solution that swells them to the size of basketballs.
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Demonoid
Yes. I rotate between that and Thepiratebay for specific titles.
And you would probably need this -
http://www.geocities.com/davidayton/CDisplay
And it goes without saying, if I enjoy a title enough, I generally go out of my way to purchase it (although most likely used on Amazon, so maybe that doesn't really make a difference). Like Watchmen and League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, I could torrent, but I think because Alan Moore tends to exhaust all of what's possible with the medium, a digital extraction won't suffice. Whereas a lot of long running titles tend to be more no-nonsense as far as the sequentials go.
Also, libraries nowadays tend to stock at least a few graphic novels. I found Shutterbug Follies, A Contract with God and Blankets there. Oh, Blankets is another good first-try or whatever.
I'm going to buy the Madman Gargantua book soon. Anyone have it?
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In short, a chat with a bodybuilder leads to a session in which the protangonist's testicles are shot full of a saline solution that swells them to the size of basketballs.
Is this to compensate for the shrinkage associated with steroid use?
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Chapter 13 except, Crooked Little VEin by Warren Ellis.
"This is where we shoot salt water into your testicles," said Gary.
He'd converted a big room in the back of the house into a huge walk-in shower room, with sound speakers recessed high into the walls.
"You're going to have to take your clothes off," Gary observed. "Not that I'm looking forward to seeing you naked, believe me. You're in shitty shape for a private detective."
"How many private detectives do you know?"
"Well...there's Magnum."
"Get away from me."
"Drop 'em."
"So this is the deal. I let you do this thing to me, and I get the receipt."
"Right. And quit with the 'do this thing to me' like I'm gonna mutilate you or something. This'll be fun."
"This is what you do for fun?"
"I get some buddies around, we shoot some saline, we have fun. It's a party thing. Play some music, have some drinks, you know. I mean, it's not like we meet in the alleyways and mutter, 'wanna do some saline?' It's on the Web, right? Like your girlfriend said."
"She's not my girlfriend."
"You sure?"
"I would have noticed."
He cocked his head to one side. "Huh. Maybe not. She's way cooler than you are. Straight people are so fucking weird."
Aryan Guy came in, stark naked and carrying steaming jugs of water. "Let's give this guy some balls," he laughed.
Trix followed him in, holding a small medical bag. She winked at me. "I want to see this."
"I'm your fucking thesis now?"
"You need to relax," she said, handing Gary the bag. "This is going to be a new experience for you. Just enjoy it for what it is."
"It's being trapped in a shower with a gay cop who wants to mutilate my nuts, Trix."
"Oh, will you unclench? Now get 'em of."
"Gary, does she have to be here?"
"Trix wants to be here, man."
"I don't want her to see me naked."
"Dude none of us wants to see you naked."
end of excerpt.
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Thanks, totep!
From that excerpt the writing isn't exactly wowing me. You'd think Ellis would be aces at dialogue-heavy scenes, but apparently not?
I don't know, maybe I'm judging him harshly. I just read The Big Sleep, and Raymond Chandler is basically the king of snappy P.I. dialogue, so maybe Ellis pales in comparison.
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Raymond Chandler had his characters say "dude" too!
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Thanks, totep!
From that excerpt the writing isn't exactly wowing me. You'd think Ellis would be aces at dialogue-heavy scenes, but apparently not?
I don't know, maybe I'm judging him harshly. I just read The Big Sleep, and Raymond Chandler is basically the king of snappy P.I. dialogue, so maybe Ellis pales in comparison.
I agree. But only after typing that out. It seemed to read better when I first read it for some reason.
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Thanks for helping me re-live that.
>Shiver<
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Am I the only comic book reader who is less than impressed with Grant Morrison on Batman?
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I haven't been reading his Batman, but I've been less than impressed with most of Grant Morrison since the 90s. Not sure if I've grown out of him, if he's had a slump, or if I've just been picking his rotten stuff to try. I did like the Superman comic he wrote that was given out for free comic book day.
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Morrison's Batman is pretty lame, but I think a lot of that has to do with him getting saddled with Tony Daniel as artist. Sometimes he can really make a sub-par artist work (I've never been crazy about Howard Porter, but JLA really clicked), but Daniel seems like a lost cause - all the bad parts of the Image artists with none of the good.
I've liked a good deal of his post-90s output - We3 was pretty awesome, and I like All-Star Superman and Final Crisis quite a bit. I liked how insane Seaguy was, but The Filth seemed kinda pointless. Seven Soldiers and New X-Men were hit-or-miss for me, though after reading Doug Wolk's Reading Comics, I want to check the former out again.
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Is anybody else aware of/reading Freakangels (http://www.freakangels.com/)? It's penned by Ellis and released free on the internet every friday. I've been following, and it looks like it's actually about to get much more interesting, thankfully. Up until now it's sort of just been a quiet, half-hearted story about these magical, post-apocalyptic, steampunk teens, eking out an existence in a flooded London, but I predict excitement is coming very soon, given the last couple of issues (if they keep it up at all). At any rate, it's been a good read.
As to Morrison, I love forever We3, and The Invisibles as much as it melted my brain to read.
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Morrison's Batman is pretty lame, but I think a lot of that has to do with him getting saddled with Tony Daniel as artist. Sometimes he can really make a sub-par artist work (I've never been crazy about Howard Porter, but JLA really clicked), but Daniel seems like a lost cause - all the bad parts of the Image artists with none of the good.
Yeah, that's a good assessment. I was really surprised Tony of all people got offered that book.
I'd also say I don't think Morrison really gets Batman anymore, or Bruce Wayne at least. His JLA version of him was much better than this current run, which I gave up very early on. Too much stream of consciousness nonsense, Morrison needs an editor to reign him in more than any other writer out there - but everyone seems afraid to do that for some reason.
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I should add about Tony Daniel though is that his Batman work is the best stuff he's ever done, and he's grown significantly over this run. And a lot of the Image comparison is the fault of the coloring, which has been pretty awful. If his pages went straight to colors from pencils too I think it'd look a lot better as well.
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Yeah, I think Morrison is trying too hard to reinvent Batman with this high-concept, "let's combine the goofy Silver Age Batman and the sexy 70s Neal Adams Batman with the creepy Frank Miller/Golden Age psycho" thing, and it's sort of sliding off the rails. It's funny, because he was the last writer to reinvent Batman - until his JLA depiction, everyone had been imitating the Miller Batman since the 80s. Morrison's genius in JLA was to take all of those heroes as they were being depicted at the time and make them work together, even though DC editorial made all of those characters so totally independent and adversarial (in other words, Marvel-ized them) that something like the JLA was almost unimaginable. The way he handled gruff, Miller-Batman next to all of these brightly-colored, near-omnipotent leotard boys was a stroke of genius.
After that, though, everything became a weak imitation of Morrison's JLA characterizations (or, alternately, Warren Ellis' Authority). Batman beating Galactus or The Spectre or God became routine and boring, and in the hands of most writers turned out to be a deus ex machina most of the time - there was a certain genius to Batman defeating the White Martians (can't believe I just typed that) or Lex Luthor, or Green Arrow and the Atom killing Darkseid, that has since gone unmatched.
That said, I'm glad Morrison is upending the cliche he inadvertently birthed by taking Batman right off the board in Final Crisis #2. This series seems awesome so far. I really do think he's the first writer since Kirby to do anything interesting with the New Gods.
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If (and that's a BIG "if") I were going to tackle Final Crisis, having mostly ignored DC Comics for the last 10 years, would I be able to dive in? Is is self-contained, or do I have to read 52, and Countdown to Final Crisis, etc., etc., etc.
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Bryan, I think you should be able to follow it without having read anything - Morrison has actually disavowed Countdown. Some of it might be a little confusing (Morrison is actually pretty Godard-like in that he leaves a lot out and lets the reader put it together, plus almost all superhero comics are bewildering to the casual reader), but most of what I've read so far is either new to this series, or was only lightly touched on elsewhere (like the ghetto New Gods or the Alpha Lanterns).
Anyway, flip through it in the store and see how you like it - I still have to read all the pamphlets, because in my heart I am still 6 y/o, but it will probably be better in trade paperback form.
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Thanks, Jason. It should be noted that prior to the 10 years of ignoring DC Comics, there was about 15 years of paying very close attention indeed.
I do like the New Gods, though.
Anyone shelled out for the Kirby Omnibuses that've been recently published? I'm close to convincing myself to do it. As a compromise I keep buying the cheapo "Showcase Presents" books. As a kid I loved Batman, but those classic Superman stories have charmed the hell out of me.
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Yeah, Silver Age Superman was pretty awesome at age 9 or 10. And while Morrison's take on the New Gods borders on the cheesy (Ving Rhames Darkseid, e.g.), it's the first I've seen that actually does justice to the characters (except maybe Legends in like 1986, though it's been a while).
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After that, though, everything became a weak imitation of Morrison's JLA characterizations (or, alternately, Warren Ellis' Authority). Batman beating Galactus or The Spectre or God became routine and boring, and in the hands of most writers turned out to be a deus ex machina most of the time - there was a certain genius to Batman defeating the White Martians (can't believe I just typed that) or Lex Luthor, or Green Arrow and the Atom killing Darkseid, that has since gone unmatched.
Yeah, I remember the segue from that last JLA arc of his, whatever it was, Tower of Babel maybe, into Mark Waid's run seemed very easy. Not to insult Waid, but they are and were very different style of writers, but Morrison I think just blew his load early on and limped his way through a lot of that latter half of the run. I remember that book being a really big hit for DC at a time when that didn't happen too often. Although that last arc had a lot of the annoying stream style writing he does I hate - it's reminds me of badly translated anime in a lot of ways, from his brain to script it just feels like we missed stuff in the translation. Characters spewing nonsense techno-drug-babble line after another just to move the story along without much explanation. His X-men run had tons of that too.
As for Neal Adams, I can see a heavy influence towards that in Daniel's newer stuff actually. It's really subtle, just stuff around the eyes, some of the framing and panel layouts. I went to his blog after my last post and saw a few pencilled pages from recent issues that really show that off. Of course he still has too much of all the awful Image/Brett Booth influences in his work too, but he's come a long way since his "The Fifth" days (yikes!).
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Black Hole was really great, Skim by Mariko and Jillian Tamaki was great, Ice Haven and Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron were great! (I already read both years ago, but I was like 15 at the time, so it doesn't count).
I second Black Hole, or anything by Dan Clowes as a first comic book for a grown-up. I wouldn't recommend any superhero stuff whatsoever - unless you got into it as a kid and have that nostalgia factor, it's pretty dumb. (Though, obviously, I do love a lot of it).
This is a golden age for good, sophisticated comics.
And also a good time, from what I hear, for genre junk that's labelled "For Mature Readers" but is actually mostly appropriate for 15 year olds. Anytime I try to read that Vertigo-type stuff I'm left really cold. I feel like I'm watching bad tv. Or maybe so-so tv.
Im about half way through Black Hole. Just found out David Fincher is going to make it into a film.
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The Washington Post recently published a profile of the comics industry - apparently just about the only branch of the publishing industry that's actually growing. Anyway, it could easily have turned out as a "Bam! Pow! Comics Aren't Just For Kids Anymore!" type story, but instead it's an indepth and nuanced look at the industry. He talks to Art Spiegelman, Francoise Mouly, Adrian Tomine, etc. Well worth a look, especially for people like Andy, who are looking to dip their toes into the world of comics.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/08/22/ST2008082201503.html
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ok, I just can't get into comic books. maybe, are there some comics that are more humorous than action/adventure? something like the middle aged batman that I saw in someones gogle reader where he looks like jon lovitz?
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I've tried and tried to get into mainstream comics but most of them are just terrible. Most of everything is terrible, of course. But comics are one of the few genres where the "golden" age or classic stuff is just about the worst.
That said, most of the artsy fartsy kinds of things on Fantagraphics and so forth are pretty good, and I did enjoy Watchmen, the Sandman, and a few other obvious ones, but none of them ever lived up to their hype. Even newer "good" mainstream comics like Y the Last Man bored the hell out of me after a couple of issues.
I always get the impression that people really want comics to be better than they are.
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Hi-five, yesno.
I have a few comic groupie friends that seem like they're trying to force it. I love how they knot themselves over comic book movies as well. The semantic debates are hilarious for a few minutes until they become so pointless I feel like dumping cold water over everyone.
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I've tried and tried to get into mainstream comics but most of them are just terrible. Most of everything is terrible, or course. But comics are one of the few genres where the "golden" age or classic stuff is just about the worst.
That said, most of the artsy fartsy kinds of things on Fantagraphics and so forth are pretty good, and I did enjoy Watchmen, the Sandman, and a few other obvious ones, but none of them ever lived up to their hype. But even newer "good" mainstream comics like Y the Last Man bored the hell out of me after a couple of issues.
I always get the impression that people really want comics to be better than they are.
I totally agree with this, the only comic that I really fell in love with was the Krazy Kat stuff, and also anything that the Friedman's touch has me laughing out loud in public (much like the Best Show).
I tried getting on board with that Y series too, I had that sinking feeling from the get go. Now I have three of those things polluting my shelves.
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There are lots of funny comics - Johnny Ryan, Ivan Brunetti, Rick Altergott, Michael Kupperman, Tony Millionaire and Daniel Clowes all do funny stuff, at varying toxicity levels. Lots of others do stuff that's 'fun' if not 'funny'.
I agree that most mainstream comics are awful and self-serious, but I love the old-timey superhero stuff. Back when Bam! Pow! Comics were just for kids anymore, and as a result they were silly and fun. Silver Age Superman comics, for example, are weird as hell.
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I agree that most mainstream comics are awful and self-serious, but I love the old-timey superhero stuff. Back when Bam! Pow! Comics were just for kids anymore, and as a result they were silly and fun. Silver Age Superman comics, for example, are weird as hell.
YES! Superman could get surreal with their villains. Trying to keep the Man Of Steel menaced isn't easy, and those writers had to get creative.
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Batman comics aren't as hokey- at least modern stuff, maybe 88-present. But, I don't really get into the action stuff. Watchmen and Batman are great and I liked Marvel Civil War as well. I think a lot of people who are into comics are really talking about graphic novels which are way different than what you find on the rack at the bookstore. If you use torrents there's one out there called the 100 graphic novels ever or something like that and that's worth checking out. If you don't like any of that, you probably aren't ever going to like the format.
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There is almost nothing better out there right now than Brubaker's Captain America. And I barely read any superhero stuff at all anymore.
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I have been enjoying Captain America lately, but I'm really looking for the resolution of this seemingly never ending "Death of Captain America" story line.
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Yeah, ditto. As recently as 6 months ago Captain America was at the top of the stack, but it's starting to become a snooze. I like Bucky as Cap, though, and hope they keep him.
I also have to say that Bendis has won me over a little with this Secret Invasion jazz. It's still a little bit like superheroes as the Howard Stern show, and he doesn't seem to care whether or not the Avengers appear in The Avengers, but it's pretty entertaining stuff.
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I've been trying to figure out how to write down Mark Ramone's pronunciation of "comic books."
Neither comet boots or comet buts looks right.
Comet bʊts? (I think the correct IPA symbol). Büts?
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If you're a fan of Brian Bendis (in spite of his adoration for Howard Stern), you might already know that he does a episode of John Suintres' Wordballoon podcast once or twice a year. Bendis' episode is made up of questions asked from members of his message board and they call them "The Bendis Tapes" after a story in Daredevil called "The Murdock Papers." I posted a mention that Tom was looking to write for Marvel and it got a pretty half-assed reaction. If you want to listen here's the link:
http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showthread.php?t=160714
(I think he answers the Tom question somewhere between the fifteen and twenty minute mark on part 3)
Between the campaign for his 33 1/3 book and this, I think it's all gonna start happening for Mr. Scharpling.
I read a bunch of the Marvel stuff when the trades come out, but also stuff like Walking Dead, Wasteland, Fear Agent, Scalped, and Criminal. I haven't kept up on Brubakers Daredevil, but I plan to eventually.
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i used to like the runaways but the new reboot is all sorts of awful.
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If you're a fan of Brian Bendis (in spite of his adoration for Howard Stern), you might already know that he does a episode of John Suintres' Wordballoon podcast once or twice a year. Bendis' episode is made up of questions asked from members of his message board and they call them "The Bendis Tapes" after a story in Daredevil called "The Murdock Papers." I posted a mention that Tom was looking to write for Marvel and it got a pretty half-assed reaction. If you want to listen here's the link:
http://www.606studios.com/bendisboard/showthread.php?t=160714
(I think he answers the Tom question somewhere between the fifteen and twenty minute mark on part 3)
Between the campaign for his 33 1/3 book and this, I think it's all gonna start happening for Mr. Scharpling.
I read a bunch of the Marvel stuff when the trades come out, but also stuff like Walking Dead, Wasteland, Fear Agent, Scalped, and Criminal. I haven't kept up on Brubakers Daredevil, but I plan to eventually.
I thought Bendis's reaction was pretty funny, just for assuming Tom was some morning zoo type schmuck. Bendis is buds with Patton Oswalt so Patton might have to show him the way of TBS. If anything I think being a fan of Howard Stern might make Bendis more likely to become a fan of Tom. I know plenty of people who love Stern and Sharpling and totally eschew any other comedy/talk-type radio.
FYI Brubaker's run of Daredevil is nowhere near as good as Bendis's though it's still quite enjoyable.
I posted a "50 Things I Love About Comics" list on my blog if any of you are interested in reading it: http://theunblinkingear.blogspot.com/2008/08/50-things-i-love-about-comics.html (http://theunblinkingear.blogspot.com/2008/08/50-things-i-love-about-comics.html)
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Matt Fraction is an FOT too, time for some folks to set Bendis straight.
EDIT - Just listened to that bit. If Cebulski is the gauntlet Tom has to run through, then it might not be worth it.
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I actually do a podcast on comic books...but I won' say what it is. I feel odd plugging it.
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I think it's even odder to tease us like that.
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I think it's even odder to tease us like that.
I just hate joining a forum and within 20 posts start plugging myself. Then again I guess I could have not mentioned doing a podcast about comic books. I guess I am complicated.
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Just wait 3 more posts and then tell us, and I think you'll be in the clear.
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I actually do a podcast on comic books...but I won' say what it is. I feel odd plugging it.
I love your podcast Tom, you are the reason I started listening to the Best Show in the first place.
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I actually do a podcast on comic books...but I won' say what it is. I feel odd plugging it.
Hey, I listen to your podcast, too. I giggled when I saw your picture in the picture section.
Perhaps it would be more appropriate for one of your listeners to plug your show.
Not me, though. I have less posts than you and am even more complicated (that word means disoriented, right?)
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http://www.aroundcomics.com/
There.
Jesus Christ, was that so hard, people?
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As somebody who is new to comic books/graphic novels, what is worth checking out? I've been reading Y: the Last Man (which I think is a very fun read so far) along with 100 Bullets and Stray Bullets (both of which are okay but I'm not really going crazy for). I've heard good things about The Watchmen, The Sandman, and The Walking Dead but I'm clueless beyond that. Any suggestions?
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I think Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics is a good primer - it will lead you to well-known and lesser-known stuff, and is descriptive enough that you'll have a pretty good idea of what you won't like (for example, Wolk advocates for Cerebus, but in a way where I still know I probably won't like it.
Generally speaking, you can't go wrong with Dan Clowes. Other than that, I'd recommend going back through the thread and looking at what people have to say - lots of good reviews and recommendations here.
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Preacher is a pretty good chaser for Y I've heard (or vice versa). Really any of the better Vertigo series wouldn't be a bad way to go next, Transmet or Sandman etc.
Box Office Poison is a whole heckuva lot of fun too.
(for example, Wolk advocates for Cerebus, but in a way where I still know I probably won't like it.
I've somewhat tried to get into that a few times and failed, aside from all the weird stuff about Sim personally. What's your take on it as far as the probably not going to like it aspect?
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Well, actually, I had followed it for a while, during the latter part of what Wolk calls its best period (late 80s/early 90s), and I wasn't all that into it then, either. Wolk makes a case for ignoring Sim's loony misogyny, but I can't really separate it from my feelings about his work, which veers between boringly pretentious and totally insane. The art's pretty good, but everyone says that that's the work of his inker, Gerhard.
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I think Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics is a good primer
Oddly, I'm in the middle of it right now. (Okay, not so oddly, I purchased it when I saw it listed in your "best of" book list) But yeah, great book, THANKS, GROTE.
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As somebody who is new to comic books/graphic novels, what is worth checking out? I've been reading Y: the Last Man (which I think is a very fun read so far) along with 100 Bullets and Stray Bullets (both of which are okay but I'm not really going crazy for). I've heard good things about The Watchmen, The Sandman, and The Walking Dead but I'm clueless beyond that. Any suggestions?
Walking Dead is quite good.
Some suggestions:
1)Fear Agent - a sort of sci-fi genre excercise that involves 50s sci-fi, westerns, and war comics. Art by Tony Moore who was the original artist on Walking Dead.
2)Local by Brian Wood & Ryan Kelly. Story about a girl traveling around the country and each issue takes place in a different city. They pay close attention to making the artistic representations of the art match the actual city. Leans a little more toward the sad bastard end of the spectrum.
3)Scott Pilgrim. Series of graphic novels by Bryan Lee O'Malley. A little more toward the silly side but pretty funny. Deals with 20 something musician with some surreal elements.
4)Action Philosophers - a series of funny and informative graphic novels explaining different philosophers in layman's terms.
5)If you like Y you might want to try Pride of Baghdad. It is a graphic novel by the same writer about escaped lions in Baghdad during the Iraq war. Some pretty heady stuff.
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I think Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics is a good primer
Oddly, I'm in the middle of it right now. (Okay, not so oddly, I purchased it when I saw it listed in your "best of" book list) But yeah, great book, THANKS, GROTE.
My pleasure! I think it's a great piece of work, even if you don't like comics - I wish most drama critics were half as good as Wolk.
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2)Local by Brian Wood & Ryan Kelly. Story about a girl traveling around the country and each issue takes place in a different city. They pay close attention to making the artistic representations of the art match the actual city. Leans a little more toward the sad bastard end of the spectrum.
There's a big hardcover of the complete series of Local coming out soon. It's scheduled for this month, but it's an indie and might be a bit late. I ordered mine from amazon, but I'm sure it'll be in local comic shops and wherever people usually buy the comics.
I've just been reading my Alias omnibus that collects the whole series. It's a Marvel Max book, which is Marvel's mature readers imprint, but it's very connected to stuff that happens in books like Daredevil and some great connections to the Avengers and Spider-Man. It's written by Brian Bendis with great art by Michael Gaydos and a few guest artists.
Has anyone mentioned Scalped? Jason Aaron's modern noir on a Native American reservation. It's a bit too much like the Departed, but it's a good read.
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2)Local by Brian Wood & Ryan Kelly. Story about a girl traveling around the country and each issue takes place in a different city. They pay close attention to making the artistic representations of the art match the actual city. Leans a little more toward the sad bastard end of the spectrum.
There's a big hardcover of the complete series of Local coming out soon. It's scheduled for this month, but it's an indie and might be a bit late. I ordered mine from amazon, but I'm sure it'll be in local comic shops and wherever people usually buy the comics.
I've just been reading my Alias omnibus that collects the whole series. It's a Marvel Max book, which is Marvel's mature readers imprint, but it's very connected to stuff that happens in books like Daredevil and some great connections to the Avengers and Spider-Man. It's written by Brian Bendis with great art by Michael Gaydos and a few guest artists.
Has anyone mentioned Scalped? Jason Aaron's modern noir on a Native American reservation. It's a bit too much like the Departed, but it's a good read.
I love Scalped. That id one dark book, unrelenting in the fact that things just get worse and worse for Daschiel.
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I'm a huge fan of American Splendor so I was wondering if any other Underground Comix are worth checking out.
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I'd recommend going to your local Barnes and Nobles graphic novel section and thumbing through collections by any of the following and seeing if they tickle your fancy:
Dan Clowes
Chris Ware
Jaime Hernandez
Gilbert Hernandez
Ariel Schrag
Robert Crumb
Adrian Tomine
Chester Brown
Charles Burns
David B.
Joe Sacco
Will Eisner
Jason
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Can you give me titles? I do read Love and Rockets, all of Dan Clowes and I've read some R.Crumb. The rest of those authors aren't familiar.
I would like to know about the underground scene now, but I was kind of asking about the actual Underground Comix scene which Pekar and Crumb were a part of. There's a ton of it and I know the big ones but don't know anything about the rest.
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You should check out the comic journal boards, they tend to skew towards that stuff more than Marvel/DC stuff, that is unless they are complaining about them - which they do a lot. A LOT.
The Small Press Expo is coming up in a few weekends too, and it's probably the best collection of non-mainstream books and artists in that sort of venue for sure. If you can go, I highly suggest it.
Also, my local comic shop is run by a guy who has had his finger in the underground scene of the last 15 or so years. His store is really small, and caters almost strictly to underground books, zines, and non-Marvel/DC/Image type stuff. His site is kind of weird, but digging around on there might give you some insight into stuff that is going on in the "underground" scene now.
http://home.earthlink.net/~copaceticcomicsco/
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Cool. I'll have to lurk over on the Comic Journal boards. Thanks man.
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The old-school underground was a mixed bag. A lot of it hasn't aged well (the Fabulous Furry Freak Bros., for example). There's a new book out called Rebel Visions (http://www.fantagraphics.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=1456&category_id=546&manufacturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=62) that's a history of the movement, with lots and lots of strips reprinted. I have an inexpensive book that reprints a few hundred pages of the classic undergrounds, too. I'll look up the title at home and pass it on. It was under $20 for 300-400 pages, and would give you a good taste of what was being done back in the day. In any case, Crumb is the most famous of those guys for a reason. He was a genius!
I like Kim Deitch a lot - he's one of the old timers, and his newer work (Blvd. of Broken Dreams, Alias the Cat) is hallucinatory and fun. I think Seth's comics (It's a Good Life if You Don't Weaken) and Chester Brown's (The Playboy, I Never Liked You) are similar in a lot of ways to Pekar's and Crumb's stuff.
There's a new collection of Aline Kominsky-Crumb's work. Her illustration style is REALLY jarring, and I'd never before read much of her stuff because I was turned off by it. But I read the new book, and it's actually wonderful.
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Yeah, Seth is amazing. Wimbledon Green is one of my favorite things that has come from any publisher in recent years, especially considering it was kind of a throwaway sketch exercise too.
http://www.bookslut.com/fiction/2006_02_007806.php
Pretty much anything Drawn & Quarterly puts out would probably appeal to you if you're looking for more underground books.
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The reason I ask is because I found a torrent that has them all in there but it's very poorly seeded and very slow so I'm being choosy of what I want to look at.
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Is anyone else as big a fan as I am of James Stevenson's historical "Lost And Found New York" drawing pieces for the NY Times Op-Ed page that show up every once in a while? I was pretty excited when they came out in book form last year. (http://www.amazon.com/Lost-Found-New-York-Heartbreakers/dp/0061260630/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1222361512&sr=1-1) That guy's loose, cocktail-napkiny drawing style always makes me smile.
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Gilly, if you post the contents of the torrent, I'd be happy to make some recommendations. I know a fair amount about the old undergrounds.
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I'm at work and can't access it but in a nutshell it's everything listed on this wikipedia entry. I think the only stuff that's missing in that entry is the sex-oriented comix like Cherry Poptart. I kind of avoided that stuff...or is some of that actually decent?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_comics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_comics)
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Arcade is probably worth a look, and Binky Brown Meets the Holy Virgin Mary definitely is. It's (I think) regarded as the first autobiographical comic, and is quite funny. I also like Vaughn Bode, Robert Williams, Mad Peck, Skip Williamson, Rory Hayes and Kim Deitch. The Witzend anthology sounds like it could be interesting, though I've never seen it.
I've never really investigated dirty comics, except the ones that have Crumb's name on them. Hope that helps!
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I read a bunch of 'em, but I'd say my favorites include Captain America and Walking Dead. I used to like Daredevil but I gave up on it after hearing there was a Lady Bullseye on the way. I can only take reading so much punishment. Queen & Country might be my favorite book ever, though I have to say I'm excited for Mike Mignola to return to writing and drawing Hellboy, because even without him that book has been great, but I really miss his art. I keep hearing things about The Red Star returning, but until there's a remotely plausible publishing schedule (this means you too, Fell), I'm sticking with trades.
Lately I've caught up on Fables through trades and love it, which is weird because I hated the first 2 trades but then after awhile (right around the battle of Fabletown) I couldn't put it down. Just read the first trade of Scalped and I'm already knowing I'll be picking up a lot more of those books in the future.
I actually do a podcast on comic books...but I won' say what it is. I feel odd plugging it.
Tomkaters also does Tom Vs. The Flash (http://tomvsjla.libsyn.com/) (and before that Tom Vs. the JLA) which are both very funny and save me the trouble of reading golden age Flash AND Justice League Detroit. So kudos to him. I actually don't listen to around comics anymore but continue on that one.
Good lord, I just looked up 2G1C. This is around the 2G1C realm.
I liked Transmetropolitan also. Crooked Little Vein had one part that skeeved me out so badly I almost tossed the book out. It would have made a better graphic novel I suppose, but I found it really pandering.
yeah, that book was just Warren Ellis's notes for like a year transcribed into some shitty linear story. I was set to never read anything of his again (other than the amazing Fell), but I picked up Crecy when it came back out and it totally reminded me why I picked up his books to begin with.
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yeah, that book was just Warren Ellis's notes for like a year transcribed into some shitty linear story. I was set to never read anything of his again (other than the amazing Fell), but I picked up Crecy when it came back out and it totally reminded me why I picked up his books to begin with.
Because you got a new parrot? You should let it listen to The Best Show and see which Tomism it picks up first.
In fairness, Warren might win back my heart if the final issue of Planetary ever comes out, and it's good. The decline on that book the last 4-5 issues hurt, a lot, and I've never been able to read anything of his the same way since.
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I'd think that delay has more to do with Cassaday than Ellis. But then I could be wrong, since I have no idea what's holding up Fell (other than the fact that they don't get paid as much for it).
I do not own -nor have I ever- a parrot.
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Anybody see that Jonathan Ames did a graphic novel called Alcoholic?
(http://blogs.usatoday.com/popcandy/images/2008/10/01/candyalccover.jpg)
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edit - I don't wanna be a gossip. Pretend I said I like the new issue of whatever instead :)
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Anybody see that Jonathan Ames did a graphic novel called Alcoholic?
(http://blogs.usatoday.com/popcandy/images/2008/10/01/candyalccover.jpg)
I read a blurb about it (I think on the AV Club) but haven't had a chance to look at it. Unfortunately it's not the kind of thing that my local comic shop would carry. Have you seen it? I'm a fan, but not enough of one to shell out for it sight unseen.
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If the FOT board and Av Club are both endorsing it, then I'll step out and grab a copy.
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I'll give a side endorsement for anything Dean Haspiel does, he's the goods.
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Hey New Yorkers! I just saw this in the Fantagraphics Blog:
If you're anywhere near Brooklyn you would be crazy to miss a yard sale that includes Mark Newgarden (creator of the Garbage Pail Kids, etc.):
COLOSSAL Multi-Family GARAGE SALE! So big, it's practically an entire Flea Market! This weekend! Saturday, October 4 & Sunday, October 5, 10am - ?
A MOUNTAIN OF TREASURE INCLUDES: Collectibles, Antiques, Art Books, Kid’s Books, Vintage Paperbacks, All kinds of Books, Old Magazines, Advertising, Comics, Paper Ephemera, Posters, Maps, Records, Record Players, CDs, Vintage Toys, Old Squeak Toys, Vintage Games, Projectors, Vintage Film Boxes, Old Cameras, Electronics, Vintage Women's Clothes, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's & 70's Kitchenware, Assorted Vintage Trays, Housewares, Antique Linens, Fabric, Tables, Chairs, Homemade Stools, Shelves, Lamps, Clocks, Mirrors, Waste Baskets, Old Office Supplies, Old School Chairs, School Coat Rack, Old Wooden Sled, Primitive Ladder, Old Watering Cans, Christmas Paraphernalia, Kitschy Paintings, rude Vintage Gags, Mesquite Mexican Shrine, Antique Brooklyn Soda Bottles, like-new 70's TWA Flight Bags, Religious Statuettes, Vintage Wooden Butler, Mannequins, and too many Oddities to list!
Cheap prices for excellent stuff. No earlybirds please!
Williamsburg, Brooklyn @ corner of North 8th & Havemeyer Streets
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Anybody see that Jonathan Ames did a graphic novel called Alcoholic?
(http://blogs.usatoday.com/popcandy/images/2008/10/01/candyalccover.jpg)
I read a blurb about it (I think on the AV Club) but haven't had a chance to look at it. Unfortunately it's not the kind of thing that my local comic shop would carry. Have you seen it? I'm a fan, but not enough of one to shell out for it sight unseen.
Im a mild Jonathan Ames fan ive only read one of his book but this one looked interesting.
"Tale of an alcoholic writer who tries to redeem himself after years of hilarious, blurry, drunken mishaps.
The main character in The Alcoholic is "Jonathan A.," and the story begins with his introduction to drinking in high school. It continues through college and young adulthood -- parts reminded me of Augusten Burroughs' Dry, though sexier and more surreal -- and it winds through Jonathan's transformative Sept. 11 experience to the present day."
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A recurring question on this thread is "I don't know anything about comics. What are some good ones to start with?" So, here's a pretty good list (http://noisedisorder.blogspot.com/2008/10/10-ideal-books-to-introduce-readers-to.html) of suggestions.
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A recurring question on this thread is "I don't know anything about comics. What are some good ones to start with?" So, here's a pretty good list (http://noisedisorder.blogspot.com/2008/10/10-ideal-books-to-introduce-readers-to.html) of suggestions.
If thats the same list I saw last week its pretty good except for the exclusion of anything by a Harvey Pekar.
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A recurring question on this thread is "I don't know anything about comics. What are some good ones to start with?" So, here's a pretty good list (http://noisedisorder.blogspot.com/2008/10/10-ideal-books-to-introduce-readers-to.html) of suggestions.
If thats the same list I saw last week its pretty good except for the exclusion of anything by a Harvey Pekar.
Just like Watchmen and Sandman made me more interested in comics in general, there's no way I would have gotten into alternative comic books if it weren't for American Splendor.
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im not into comic books (by ignorance, not by choice), but this is one of my favorite tv channels:
http://current.com/items/89001926_virgin_comics
unfortunately, the "other" camera makes a cameo appearance halfway through.
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A recurring question on this thread is "I don't know anything about comics. What are some good ones to start with?" So, here's a pretty good list (http://noisedisorder.blogspot.com/2008/10/10-ideal-books-to-introduce-readers-to.html) of suggestions.
If thats the same list I saw last week its pretty good except for the exclusion of anything by a Harvey Pekar.
Just like Watchmen and Sandman made me more interested in comics in general, there's no way I would have gotten into alternative comic books if it weren't for American Splendor.
I hear ya!
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Just read this over on Lying in the Gutters:
SMALL SCREEN TO BIG PANELS
Dan DiDio is currently in the process of recruiting film and TV writers for their books. The recent “Batman: Cacophony” by Kevin Smith and Walt Flanagan has been cited, apparently the script was perfect, with very little editing needed.
This, of course, would be the comic where the The Joker offers his bottom to be sexually violated by his rescuer, jokes about the colour of his pubic hair, a scene depicting genital torture and no sign of a Mature Readers tag.
He never wants out of the hate pit, does he? God, can you imagine the dumb conversations Batman and Alfred are going to have, how is Smith going to shoehorn in Star Wars references there? Oh what a horrible trainwreck this is going to be.
EDIT - Or rather is, as the first issue came out last week. Yikes.
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I don't want to be known as the guy that defended Kevin Smith, because lord knows i've realized I can't stand him most of the time. And yes, the way he makes the Joker acts in the issue in question is...well terrible. But the actual story wasn't the worst. I had no intention of buying it but didn't realize it was in my pull list (I just get Batman normally, not the mini series or anything) and figured I'd give it a chance rather than put it aside without reading it. Not the best, not terrible. above average.
And I didn't know there was a comics thread on here. Very nice.
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I really liked his Daredevil run with Quesada, it was really good and might even actually hold up.
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Yeah, still probably his best comics work.
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actually, same goes for Quesada too.
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Sweet jesus! A list of 75 movies (http://denofgeek.com/movies/147293/75_comics_being_made_into_films.html) in the works that are based on comic books.
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This covered pretty much every comic I've ever heard of that isn't on Oni. Where's Barry Ween's movie? What about the Hopeless Savages?
C
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The Superhero movie genre is going to crash and burn pretty hard in a couple years.
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Yeah, that's what they keep saying, but it only ever takes a Dark Knight or an Iron Man for them to keep pumping out your Ghost Rider's and... Superhero Movies.
Half the stuff on that list probably won't happen though, at least I hope so. What'd Jim McLaughlin used to say - 'comic book movies only exist to disappoint you/us', or something like that?
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Two that I wish were on the list that aren't: The Authority, and The Walking Dead.
One that I was actually excited about on that list: Live action Justice League movie! That would be fun if they did it right.
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Did you ever see the 1997(ish) live action Justice League movie that was made?
(http://powet.tv/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/jlashowlooksliketotalshit.jpg)
I thought it would at least be "fun". It wasn't. I'd love to see it done right, but can't for the life of me imagine it happening.
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They tried to do a Justice League movie last year and it sounded like an awful idea. It was to be all CG, and introduce every character's origin in like, 120 minutes.
If they were to ever do a JLA movie (and I think that would be one insanely awesome action movie), they would REALLY benefit from doing it the way Marvel is doing it. Introduce the major players in their own movies and then have them show up in a Justice League movie, where they can introduce maybe one or two new characters (i.e. Martian Manhunter as I really don't think a movie about him would hold up, The Atom, Aquaman, etc. Basically any character that couldn't really sustain a good movie on their own).
Also, they really should not put any characters in here if they can't get the main movie's actors in it. What I mean is, if the next Batman movie is coming out and Christian Bale is Batman/Bruce Wayne, DON'T put Batman in the Justice League movie and have it be somebody else (which is what they'll have to do since Bale has said he doesn't want to do a team movie.).
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Justice League, and Avengers too, would never work in a movie. Warner's will never probably even get the JLA off the ground anyways, but I await with eager anticipation the glorious failure of this Avengers movie, it's my Pleasure Island: A Rock Fantasy. Oh it's gonna be soooo bad, I can't wait!
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Coming in 2011, a comic hero the likes of which you have never seen (if you're under 40), a story so big it has to be shrunk down just to fit on the movie screen, Kevin Smith IS
(http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee183/gaughin/Herbie-fat-fury-200.jpg)
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I'd love to see a Herbie movie. I really liked the Bob Burden version of him from the 1990s.
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I dunno if this has been discussed in this thread already, but because of the episode of TBSOWFMU with Mike Allred, I downloaded and am now reading X-Force/X-Statix. It's great! I don't get into superhero stuff usually, and I know I'm almost 10 years late to the party, but this is amazingly clever work.
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I dunno if this has been discussed in this thread already, but because of the episode of TBSOWFMU with Mike Allred, I downloaded and am now reading X-Force/X-Statix. It's great! I don't get into superhero stuff usually, and I know I'm almost 10 years late to the party, but this is amazingly clever work.
Yeah that stuff is awesome. I have the hardcover of all the x-force stuff and i love it. Wish they would do the same with x-statix as I only got into it towards the end when they fight the avengers. Seriously one of the most entertaining reads.
What show was this discussion with Mike Allred?!
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You know, I really loved Peter David's X-Factor when it first came out, and I still like it. Larry Stroman's pencils are trying their very hardest to make me hate it. This man can't draw faces, hands, bodies, clothes, or feet. He's worse than Rob Liefeld. :'(
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You know, I really loved Peter David's X-Factor when it first came out, and I still like it. Larry Stroman's pencils are trying their very hardest to make me hate it. This man can't draw faces, hands, bodies, clothes, or feet. He's worse than Rob Liefeld. :'(
Yeah, as shallow as it sounds I dropped X-Factor cuz of the art. It really ruined the reading experience regardless of the story. I hear the other artist is back so I kind of regret dropping it as the first like, 30 issues are great. A really great cast and idea for an X Book.
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I used to love Larry Stroman a lot back in the day. That Image book of his, Tribe, was great I thought.
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He's worse than Rob Liefeld. :'(
OUCH!!! wicked burn ...
Seriously, how the hell did Liefeld get so big in comics?
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He's worse than Rob Liefeld. :'(
OUCH!!! wicked burn ...
Seriously, how the hell did Liefeld get so big in comics?
The 80s happened.
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so his career is cocaine's fault ???
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I downloaded and am now reading X-Force/X-Statix.
>:(
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I downloaded and am now reading X-Force/X-Statix.
>:(
Was it the downloading or the reading that makes you grumpy, Gus?
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You know, I really loved Peter David's X-Factor when it first came out, and I still like it. Larry Stroman's pencils are trying their very hardest to make me hate it. This man can't draw faces, hands, bodies, clothes, or feet. He's worse than Rob Liefeld. :'(
Yeah, as shallow as it sounds I dropped X-Factor cuz of the art. It really ruined the reading experience regardless of the story. I hear the other artist is back so I kind of regret dropping it as the first like, 30 issues are great. A really great cast and idea for an X Book.
There's nothing shallow about dropping a book because you dislike the art. The art is integral to the experience.
It's a shame when a good writer is stuck with a crapola art but that's the difference between comics and prose.
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So i'm going to try and keep this thread alive.
Been reading Grant Morrison's JLA run from the mid 90s. Really not getting why that was such a big deal. It's pretty...meh.
And man...Electro Superman. I forgot how dumb that idea was...
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I read some of that JLA stuff - I thought it was awful, and it's permanently tarnished my perception of Grant Morrison. I used to like him in the Doom Patrol/Animal Man days.
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I read some of that JLA stuff - I thought it was awful, and it's permanently tarnished my perception of Grant Morrison. I used to like him in the Doom Patrol/Animal Man days.
Yeah I love Animal Man and the beginning of Doom Patrol (kinda got TOO crazy around volume 4 for me...). His New X-Men was fantastic though. And I'm actually enjoying Final Crisis. Batman is a mess though...
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All Star Supes is pretty great too.
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Yeah, i REALLY need to sit down and read that all the way through at once to really appreciate it I think. Over like, 3 or so years I kinda forgot what happened at the beginning by the time #12 rolled out.
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Yeah, I grabbed the 1st trade over the weekend, I slid over the series when it came out originally. Just caught an issue here and there. Worth the wait though, at least for my level of patience.
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Has anyone thought that the FOTs are the X-Men and Tommy Gunn is Professor X?
Is that's why he calls his favorite folks mutants?
I am nowhere near reading this whole board and may be discussing something addressed years ago.
If this is the case forgive me I just wandered in a short time ago.
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I've always thought of the FOT more like 70s-era Defenders, like when Howard the Duck was a member, and they fought the Headmen and that elf with the gun.
(http://www.geocities.com/marvel_megalomaniac/headmen/defenders033.jpg)
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http://www.comicsreporter.com/index.php/cr_sunday_feature_dan_vados_informal_letter_on_diamonds_new_edicts/
Depressing take on the Diamond changes from Dan Vado. Go buy some indie comics this week FOT, seriously.
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That's an interesting piece. I guess it mostly affects the monthly magazine-style books, rather than the trades/graphic novels? I don't really keep up-to-date on the nuts and bolts of comic book publishing, but I recall reading recently that comic books were currently the only area of publishing that is growing.
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In trade form, yeah, but the magazines are really slipping. And I don't know all the details, but I think that many of the trades are published by imprints of larger publishers - so it's Pantheon who's selling all those copies of Black Hole and Ghost World, not Fantagraphics.
But (again, half-talking-out-my-ass here) publishing just had a complete meltdown a couple of weeks ago, so who knows what's up. What I've heard from acquaintances at FG and Soft Skull is that it's business as usual for those guys - they were never really making a whole lot of money anyway, and their core readership is pretty loyal and not going anywhere.
What really sucks about this is the same kind of inequity and instability that's happening in every other creative or quasi-creative industry: film/TV, newspapers, music (and theater, though it's been the status quo in theater for a few decades at least). Mega-corporations pursuing the bottom line in an industry that, in most cases, isn't really built to handle economies of such scale. This leads to some talent making huge paychecks while the "farm teams" that were previously feeders into the "big leagues" are totally starved, mostly on the assumption that people who want in want in so badly that they'll do it for free and use the internet to distribute their work.
One possible bright side to the collapse is that the little guys might emerge as winners - I know at least a few small theaters that are weathering this pretty well, as they're used to surviving on nothing, not unlike Fantagraphics and Soft Skull. Except once we all emerge from the rubble, we might find out that it's even less possible to make a living at any of this than it was before.
Blah blah blah
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The push towards tpb's and graphic novels though doesn't take into account single issue comics that only come out quarterly, bi-annually, whatever. Lots of creators just cannot afford to spend 3 years working on a single graphic novel, selling the floppy issues along the way help pay the bills in a way that lets them continue doing the work on their own terms. Most indie creators (and plenty of people working for Marvel and DC too, actually) cannot even afford to put out a single issue of something in less than quarterly schedules either because they all have to work day jobs while they're working on it.
Just because Marvel and DC are shitting out trades of their titles every 4 months doesn't make it a viable strategy for a lot (probably most) of small press people. Seriously, like Vado said, I bet most people would be surprised just how few copies their favorite books sell overall (indie or mainstream comics too). Just to refer back to SLG, everyone I know loves Street Angel, but if iirc that book barely broke 3k copies an issue. Jim Rugg had an office job until like 18 months ago or something when DC finally started giving him a bunch of work - meanwhile everyone is telling him he's the hottest rising star in comics, yikes.
The Barnes & Noble/Borders comic snobs have really hurt the comic market in a way they don't seem to understand, no matter how many copies of Kramer's Ergot or Persepolis they buy.
It just sucks that Diamond has taken so many steps to monopolize the market, and now to ghettoize it as well. Especially at a time when the 2 top publishers are teetering on a very thin line between success and failure. Depressing news, and I'm probably whining more about it this morning that I will care in a week, but yeah. Boo, comics.
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I have to confess that I've been questioning my addiction to floppies. I love stopping by the comic store every Wednesday, and it took me something like 20 years to get a regular adult job so I could afford to buy everything I want to read. Except now I'm running out of room for the goddamn things, most of which I'll never read again. And even when I do want to read them again, it's a lot easier to pull a bound copy of Love & Rockets, Daredevil, or Doom Patrol off of my shelf than to big the old bagged copies out of my closet and read them one issue at a time.
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The Barnes & Noble/Borders comic snobs have really hurt the comic market in a way they don't seem to understand, no matter how many copies of Kramer's Ergot or Persepolis they buy.
Isn't it good for the industry that people buy books, no matter what format they buy them? If a person who never bought weekly floppies buys any graphic novel, they're putting money into an industry that needs it. Most people don't have the time to get to the comic book store every week or even every month. Just like music, every industry needs to adapt to the market it can sell to. The transitions are going to hurt a lot of people and the industry is going to change. You can't force people to buy weekly comics any more than you can get them to buy CDs instead of mp3s.
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I have to confess that I've been questioning my addiction to floppies. I love stopping by the comic store every Wednesday, and it took me something like 20 years to get a regular adult job so I could afford to buy everything I want to read. Except now I'm running out of room for the goddamn things, most of which I'll never read again. And even when I do want to read them again, it's a lot easier to pull a bound copy of Love & Rockets, Daredevil, or Doom Patrol off of my shelf than to big the old bagged copies out of my closet and read them one issue at a time.
I 100% agree. I try to buy trades directly from the publisher though in those cases. I'll buy my Marvel/DC stuff from Amazon, but you can buy directly from SLG, D&Q, Fanta, Top Shelf etc and feel like an art snob still too.
Most comic shops are pretty awful though too, I can only think of a handful I've been to in the country that defied the "comic book guy" stereotype, dank hole in the wall places. Much rather go to a Borders than journey into one of them, I totally understand that.
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Living in a place without decent comic shops for the last 6-7 years has forced me to say goodbye to floppies. I can't really say I miss 'em. I mostly read the upmarket stuff, or old-time collections anyway. (I guess that makes me a Barnes & Noble snob?) Sorry, publishers. Comics do seem pretty much fucked from every angle, and much of it is self-sabotage, perpetrated by just about everyone participating in the industry.
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Isn't it good for the industry that people buy books, no matter what format they buy them? If a person who never bought weekly floppies buys any graphic novel, they're putting money into an industry that needs it.
Not really though, no. It's a different route the money goes when you buy from a comic shop vs a "real" bookstore. Don't ask me to explain it, because it makes no sense to me either. Unless the creator has a really good deal in place though they don't see much of that money at all, or at least that's my understanding of it.
Plus, once a lot of books have gone to trade, they're just paying for the losses they took on printing the floppies and paying talent, advertising etc - not to mention printing the trades too. I think a book has to sell a ton (more than 2-3 copies a store) to really be considered any kind of success. Marvel is about to jump up to like $4 bucks a single issue, and I am sure that's all because of the costs of printing the things to begin with, and not a greed factor. But can you imagine, 4 bucks for like 24 pages of comic that you read in less than 10 minutes? Wow.
EDIT - Also, exactly what Jason said about who is actually publishing the prints, vs the original companies.
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Comics do seem pretty much fucked from every angle, and much of it is self-sabotage, perpetrated by just about everyone participating in the industry.
Very, very true.
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Isn't it good for the industry that people buy books, no matter what format they buy them? If a person who never bought weekly floppies buys any graphic novel, they're putting money into an industry that needs it.
Not really though, no. It's a different route the money goes when you buy from a comic shop vs a "real" bookstore. Don't ask me to explain it, because it makes no sense to me either. Unless the creator has a really good deal in place though they don't see much of that money at all, or at least that's my understanding of it.
But isn't this money that never would have gone to comics at all? I'd bet that most sales at B&N don't take away from any other comic sales anywhere, in any format. They come from casual fans who wouldn't bother stepping into a comic book shop.
Honestly, if the *NY TIMES* can't make money I have a hard time seeing how comics can.
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But isn't this money that never would have gone to comics at all? I'd bet that most sales at B&N don't take away from any other comic sales anywhere, in any format. They come from casual fans who wouldn't bother stepping into a comic book shop.
You're right most likely. I do know people who do tout themselves as comic readers/whatever who pretty much only buy from chain bookstores though, and personally it's annoying to see that happen and listen to them with any seriousness. And I know even more who have done the shift from buying floppies to waiting for the trade - a move that oddly enough Marvel and DC etc pushed for without realizing how harmful it was going to be to the industry as a whole I think. Realized or cared, I guess it's semantics there.
I think if comic shops overall were handled better generally and more inviting places to be, more people might be apt to journey into them. That's a whole other argument though...
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B&N can return books which can cause problems, especially if their damaged, I think they even tear the cover off just like they do with paperbacks. The comic shops on the other hand order what they want, and then the publishers can fill that order with no fear of returns. It's better to buy from a comic shop, but really creators just want their stuff read.
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Anyone reading Crossed Or Gravel? Those are the only comics keeping my interest these days. Maybe Fell and Desolation Jones, if they ever came out.
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I order from midtowncomics.com because I'm allergic to virgins.
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I order from midtowncomics.com because I'm allergic to virgins.
I ordered from them lots too the last few years when I was living on the east coast. They get all the cool toys.
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Comics Life does seem pretty much fucked from every angle, and much of it is self-sabotage, perpetrated by just about everyone participating in the industry.
Very, very true.
Fixed
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Comics Life does seem pretty much fucked from every angle, and much of it is self-sabotage, perpetrated by just about everyone participating in the industry.
Very, very true.
Fixed
Is there anything Dave can't do? I thank you for much entertainment, Mr. from Knoxville.
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Blech (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/adhouse-books-cancels-plans-for-superior-showcase-4/).
And more (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/new-threshold-probably-means-the-end-of-independent-serialized-comics/#more-2054) too.
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Blech (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/adhouse-books-cancels-plans-for-superior-showcase-4/).
And more (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/new-threshold-probably-means-the-end-of-independent-serialized-comics/#more-2054) too.
Future = print-on-demand
http://www.ondemandbooks.com/home.htm
Avoids this distributor horseshit.
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Blech (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/adhouse-books-cancels-plans-for-superior-showcase-4/).
And more (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/01/new-threshold-probably-means-the-end-of-independent-serialized-comics/#more-2054) too.
Future = print-on-demand
http://www.ondemandbooks.com/home.htm
Avoids this distributor horseshit.
I've been pretty disappointed in most pod jobs I've seen, and I've tried a bunch of different printers and services. The quality ranges from ok to just plain bad. Also, their pricing structure means you'll never make enough money to eat off of either, selling a couple copies here, a couple there.
Hopefully this gives some of the better printers out there with comic experience an incentive though to get into it I guess.
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I think the future of POD is that you have the machines in bookstores, not mail order. The one I linked to is good quality for b&w text. There's nothing impossible about increasing the quality for color. Either way, I think it's the future, not the present. I don't see how anything else can save smaller-scale publishing of all kinds.
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There is a new printing of Walter Simonsons Thor Visionaries that just came out this month. I picked it up and it is great. Classic Marvel heroes type of stories and this book introduces Beta Ray Bill. It's very different from how comics are today, but it's one of those books that really informs all the Marvel stuff today. Really good and different from the usual stuff I read.
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Never really read any Simonson. Who does art on that?
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Walter Simonson.
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I'm trying to get to the bottom of my read pile of trades lately and I thought I would post about some of them on here. I already posted about the Walt Simonson Thor book and now I'm reading some Warren Ellis books I got a while back.
Aetheric Mechanics: A Graphic Novella. Sort of a Sherlock Holmes story with a science fiction twist. A Dr. Watson character returns from war to find a London filled with flying machines and fantastical crime. He helps the Sherlock Holmes character solve the murder and more. I don't want to give away too much if you are going to buy this, but it's a good read though kind of short. This is part of Ellis' Apparat books from Avatar Press. There was a collection of the first four called Apparat: Volume One and since then I've gotten Crecy (about a historic battle between England and France, written in a very post-modern way with a narrator talking to the reader) and Aetheric Mechanics. The next one that's coming out is called Frankenstein's Womb, I think. They're all good one off stories with different artists. I don't think the newer ones will be collected since he's calling them graphic novellas and keeping the in print at Avatar. Aetheric Mechanics had a cool story and I'm looking forward to Frankenstein's Womb.
I've still got Ellis' Freakangels and Black Summer to read and a bunch of other stuff.
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I like Warren Ellis a lot. Haven't heard of Aetheric Mechanics but will check that out. Still waiting for that last issue of Planetary, durn it.
Today I re-read Final Crisis. Last ish comes out this week. On first read I thought this series was disconnected and made no sense. On second read, it's much, much clearer. He does sort of the same thing as in Batman RIP where part of the end happens at the beginning. Anyway, Grant Morrison is nuts.
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Doesn't he practice chaos magick (the vestigial "k" is for kooky!) or something silly like that?
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Doesn't he practice chaos magick (the vestigial "k" is for kooky!) or something silly like that?
I think that's Alan Moore, but I could be wrong.
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No, Grant Morrison is a warlock too. Or at least he was.
Now he just writes stuff that doesn't make any sense. TA-DAA!
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http://www.publishersweekly.com/article/CA6586371.html ::)
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Somebody played waaaaaay too much D & D as a kid.
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(http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/000A4kSc8Md4o/340x.jpg)
Just bought this for my kids on Ebay. I ended up reading it myself and learning an embarrassing amount of information I did not know before. Maybe it's time I read one of Obama's books.
I also bought my 5-year-old the Obama/Spiderman comic book. I learned a lot from that one as well.
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Warren Ellis' Fell is just plain awesome, and Ben Templesmith on art puts the book over the top. Too bad it's basically done. It's been almost 18 months I think since the last issue and don't think there will be a new issue anytime soon.
And yes, Final Crisis is really getting much better than what I originally thought of it. Apparently Morrison's Mister Miracle mini-series he did as part of his Seven Soldiers project has A TON to do with it and that was written in 2005, so you gotta respect the man for at least having a plan...
Also, I'm reading the hell out of anything Green Lantern I can get my hands on, and going to go through the entire James Robinson run of Starman again because it's just too good.
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I really liked Fell too and wondered what happened to it. :'(
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Ha! I posted something a few entries ago and the comic book fanatics just ran right over it like it wasn't there. They know a non-comic-book person right away.
I feel like Flounder at the beginning of Animal House when he said to the poker players, "You guys playing cards?"
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Warren Ellis' Fell is just plain awesome, and Ben Templesmith on art puts the book over the top. Too bad it's basically done. It's been almost 18 months I think since the last issue and don't think there will be a new issue anytime soon.
And yes, Final Crisis is really getting much better than what I originally thought of it. Apparently Morrison's Mister Miracle mini-series he did as part of his Seven Soldiers project has A TON to do with it and that was written in 2005, so you gotta respect the man for at least having a plan...
Also, I'm reading the hell out of anything Green Lantern I can get my hands on, and going to go through the entire James Robinson run of Starman again because it's just too good.
I read that Mister Miracle series when it came out and could not figure out why Darkseid was a dude running a club and a different guy was Mister Miracle. Haven't re-read it, but Final Crisis is finally making that one make sense. But I mean how do you foreshadow a DC main event crossover two years previous with a weirdo miniseries inside the Seven Soldiers series? I'm impressed.
Key to enjoying Grant Morrison's current superhero work is realizing that EVERYTHING is fair play and in some part of continuity. The guy made Bat-Mite and all of the sci-fi Batman stories fit into current, mainstream, 21st century Batman. I think that's awesome any way you slice it.
I came to the new run of Green Lantern late, but the last few months I've been devouring 'em. Also, the GL stuff in Final Crisis is a lot of fun.
If he wants to be a magician, good for him. He writes excellent comics.
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You know what, I love the Superman/Batman comics. I even liked Li'l JLA and Li'l Injustice League arc. I'm not kidding.
(http://www.majorspoilers.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06a/dcsolitcssept08/03superman/SMBM-Cv52_solicit.jpg)
Loved it!
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Dunno if I posted this here, apologies if I did - but I really liked Morrison's Batman run. It fell apart at the end, and was plagued by some bad art here and there. But for the most part, it was lots of fun, and felt very much like good Batman stories were before we got the franchise of Batman, you know? Pre-Burton movie era Batman even.
And yeah, tying in all the stuff he did, pretty slick.
I think he's the kind of writer though who needs an editor to reign him back in sometimes, and a lot of the time doesn't have that. He certainly is capable of writing really great stuff, that's for sure.
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Jon, I think most comic fans are kind of embarrassed by the pure crassness of the Obama comics, though by the time I'm 70 it will probably feel like cool kitsch in the same way that tons of comics from the 40s and 50s do now.
On the other hand, I just bought the stupidest Obama shirt I could find. It's got puffy silver lettering and has Obama in a Superman costume doing a slam dunk. I think a tiny John McCain was photoshopped into the crowd. The back has the accidental Obama-goatse pic designed by Alex Ross (cartoonist not music journalist), which I think has been photoshopped too, plus his signature.
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On the other hand, I just bought the stupidest Obama shirt I could find. It's got puffy silver lettering and has Obama in a Superman costume doing a slam dunk. I think a tiny John McCain was photoshopped into the crowd. The back has the accidental Obama-goatse pic designed by Alex Ross (cartoonist not music journalist), which I think has been photoshopped too, plus his signature.
Not this one, Grote? (FFWD to ~2:30 min in)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfvttJ1hXf4
My big brother has that shirt. Oh, UNDRCRWN. Why do you hate vowels?
I'll confess, I've been rocking the Alex Ross tee shirt since it first came out and wore it on Inauguration Day. It is now my favorite workout tee shirt.
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No, mine is much, much tackier. I saw it on a table on my way to work (via Penn Station/The Garden) and had to have it.
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Thanks for responding, Jason. I feel slightly less like a jackass now. If you are not of the world of comic books, then nothing seems at all wrong with the Obama comic books. I just loved how odd the pairing was.
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I think it is sad that the Obama/Spider-Man comic seemed so slapped together.
The art, other than the cover, was really sub-par and the story was just dumb. I think if Marvel had put a lot more money and talent into they may have gained some new readers. Sadly, I don't think any of the non-comic fan people who bought will be turned onto comics by this crass cashgrab.
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Yeah, Quesada is kind of a whore.
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Part of the problem -- and here is where you all get to see what a fucking dork I truly am -- is that the rest of the Marvel Universe is currently involved in a storyline wherein the erstwhile Green Goblin has taken over the national security apparatus and replaced the Avengers with supervillians in disguise. Evidently this is being addressed in at least one upcoming book, with Obama chewing out the Goblin*, but still it just smacks of opportunism.
Though at least Marvel at least slouches towards continuity these days, unlike DC. I normally couldn't care less, but it's a little anticlimactic having the entire universe end in the big crossover and not even having it reflected at all in any other comic.
Both are still better than having Dr. fucking Doom cry at the WTC site, though.
(http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/8360/weepingdoomoo9.jpg)
*I really hope someone Googles this phrase
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Yeah, Quesada is kind of a whore.
Ha, "kind of".
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Yeah, Quesada is kind of a whore.
Ha, "kind of".
Okay, okay, he's a total whore.
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Don't go all "Newsarama" on me, FOTs. You're better than that and you know it. Joe Quesada rarely, if ever, sells his body on the street. He just makes unpleasant editorial decisions that make comic book fans angry.
Well, fine.
He's a whore.
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Oh the Quesada one was short and terrible.
But the other one - the one that is a straightforward biography of Obama - was decent. Not saying the art was great (I do some cartooning, and can discern good from bad there), but it was pretty good about not just worshipping him.
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Thanks for responding, Jason. I feel slightly less like a jackass now. If you are not of the world of comic books, then nothing seems at all wrong with the Obama comic books. I just loved how odd the pairing was.
I didn't respond because I've not only never read either comic, nor even seen them. You're totally welcome in the nerd treefort though Jon.
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Part of the problem -- and here is where you all get to see what a fucking dork I truly am -- is that the rest of the Marvel Universe is currently involved in a storyline wherein the erstwhile Green Goblin has taken over the national security apparatus and replaced the Avengers with supervillians in disguise. Evidently this is being addressed in at least one upcoming book, with Obama chewing out the Goblin*, but still it just smacks of opportunism.
Though at least Marvel at least slouches towards continuity these days, unlike DC. I normally couldn't care less, but it's a little anticlimactic having the entire universe end in the big crossover and not even having it reflected at all in any other comic.
Both are still better than having Dr. fucking Doom cry at the WTC site, though.
I may be biased towards Marvel (I was pretty much exclusively a Marvel fan from the age of 6-16) but I don't really mind if Obama is the president in the comics. Yeah, the Spidey thing was GREAT for press, sales, and more, but they are hardly the only comic to do it (Savage Dragon, Youngblood, and a couple others I think...). And yes, Marvel at least TRIES for continuity. As much as I like Final Crisis and such, the tie ins REALLY don't flow together at all. At least most of the time in Marvel there is a pretty universal idea of what is going on in other titles.
And I really am not a fan of the debate about Dr. Doom shedding a tear. It's a single issue right after 9/11 and you could EASILY say it's not even in continuity as that issue has never ever been referenced and it was symbolism to show how tragic 9/11 was (even though, honestly, I don't anybody DIDN'T realize that) but it's was just a symbolic image to, in my opinion, say "we're evil, but we can't do this to anybody in real life". That issue of Amazing was and still is one of my favorite issues of Amazing because for somebody kind of far removed from New York when 9/11 happened, it was one of the first times I really just felt terrible about it. But i understand why some don't like it but...c'mon. Dr. Doom isn't real, let him show an ounce of humanity for once.
So on that note....who else is excited for the return of "The Spot?"
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Thanks for responding, Jason. I feel slightly less like a jackass now. If you are not of the world of comic books, then nothing seems at all wrong with the Obama comic books. I just loved how odd the pairing was.
I didn't respond because I've not only never read either comic, nor even seen them. You're totally welcome in the nerd treefort though Jon.
Thanks erechoveraker. But I will listen quietly in the corner of the treefort for a while.
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Dunno if I posted this here, apologies if I did - but I really liked Morrison's Batman run. It fell apart at the end, and was plagued by some bad art here and there. But for the most part, it was lots of fun, and felt very much like good Batman stories were before we got the franchise of Batman, you know? Pre-Burton movie era Batman even.
And yeah, tying in all the stuff he did, pretty slick.
I think he's the kind of writer though who needs an editor to reign him back in sometimes, and a lot of the time doesn't have that. He certainly is capable of writing really great stuff, that's for sure.
Agreed. But I would be curious to know how much of an editorial decision it was to fold the RIP stuff into Final Crisis. That seemed like a clear editorial decision to move the conclusion of that storyline into the larger, off-schedule Final Crisis. In the end, I liked what happened with Batman in FC, but it definitely did make the RIP story unravel towards the end.
Aaand, I also didn't read the Obama, Spidey comic because the AP's writeup gave away the ending: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090108/ap_en_ot/obama_spider_man
They could have at least put SPOILER in the headline.
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I just finished reading the Five Fists of Science by Matt Fraction and Steven Sanders. It's a great book about Nikola Tesla and Mark Twain teaming up to rid the world of war and doing battle with Thomas Edison and his cult. Really imaginative and hilarious book.
Then, I finished listening to the Best Show podcast to hear Matt Fraction calling the show again. It kind of freaked me out. Also,I really wish he would have done his Orson Welles impression that he did on the Wordballoon podcast a while back, but it was great to hear from him anyhow.
Do you think this was a strange coincidence or a sign that I should buy the Casanova trade?
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I just finished reading the Five Fists of Science by Matt Fraction and Steven Sanders. It's a great book about Nikola Tesla and Mark Twain teaming up to rid the world of war and doing battle with Thomas Edison and his cult. Really imaginative and hilarious book.
Then, I finished listening to the Best Show podcast to hear Matt Fraction calling the show again. It kind of freaked me out. Also,I really wish he would have done his Orson Welles impression that he did on the Wordballoon podcast a while back, but it was great to hear from him anyhow.
Do you think this was a strange coincidence or a sign that I should buy the Casanova trade?
It's a sign. Go get Casanova, it's an awesome mind-bending book. Fraction throws everything into the pot and Ba draws the hell out of it. I can't wait for vol 2. to come out. Also, if you get your hands on the Immortal Iron Fist trades as well; I haven't read Five Fists but it sounds like it's got the same pulpy vibe that Iron Fist does.
So I just got done reading a bunch of stuff as well:
Top Ten Season 1 and Top Ten: The 49ers. I think this was some of the most amazing superhero comics I've ever read; just brilliant writing from Moore - really human characters, fun, interesting stories and some really great emotional moments, especially in the 49ers. I know that I shouldn't be surprised because it's Alan Moore, but I don't think I've had this much fun reading a superhero comic in ages (New Frontier maybe?) which is kind of sad. It's probably a more of a reflection on current superhero comics than anything else though.
Also read Aya which was fairly slight but a lot of fun. I liked the soap-opera vibe to it all and I'm interested in seeing where the stories go in the next volume.
Next on my list: Scott Pilgrim 5 if there's any copies left at the store tomorrow!
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I read Iron First TPB vol. 3 earlier this week. Such a fantastic book. This is a great genre story that introduces the Iron Fist legacy to new fans and the art from Aja and multiple other artists is incredible. The three trades make a great run and I just saw that these books are getting the Omnibus treatment. So if anyone is thinking of getting them, buying them in a big-ass over-sized hardcover is a beautiful way to read a good comic book.
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Those Iron Fist books are awesomely good. I just read the third one the other night. I'm on the fence as to whether or not I should continue with it as Matt Fraction is leaving it/has left it. I've been following it in trades, so I read it at a delay. Anyone like the new guy?
And Scott Pilgrim 5 is very very good. Bryan Lee O'Malley was at a signing at Rocket Ship here in Brooklyn this past Wednesday. I did not know about it at all, but stopped by the shop on Thursday to find out that not only were they sold out but I'd missed a signing! Anyway, picked it up yesterday and enjoyed it quite a bit. I'll be sad to see this series end. But then, I like endings and comics aren't often good at ending. Like ever.
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Son O God vs. Bobby Zimmerman
(http://www.punkhart.com/dylan/images/zimmerman2-cover.gif)
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So I just got done reading a bunch of stuff as well:
Top Ten Season 1 and Top Ten: The 49ers. I think this was some of the most amazing superhero comics I've ever read; just brilliant writing from Moore - really human characters, fun, interesting stories and some really great emotional moments, especially in the 49ers. I know that I shouldn't be surprised because it's Alan Moore, but I don't think I've had this much fun reading a superhero comic in ages (New Frontier maybe?) which is kind of sad. It's probably a more of a reflection on current superhero comics than anything else though.
Top 10 is great! I have yet to read volume 2 but I picked volume 1 up a few years ago when I was literally buying a trade a week and needed something completely new. Very cool concept. I am interested to check out some more of Moore's ABC Line (especially Promethea. Love JH Williams III's art!)
Those Iron Fist books are awesomely good. I just read the third one the other night. I'm on the fence as to whether or not I should continue with it as Matt Fraction is leaving it/has left it. I've been following it in trades, so I read it at a delay. Anyone like the new guy?
And Scott Pilgrim 5 is very very good. Bryan Lee O'Malley was at a signing at Rocket Ship here in Brooklyn this past Wednesday. I did not know about it at all, but stopped by the shop on Thursday to find out that not only were they sold out but I'd missed a signing! Anyway, picked it up yesterday and enjoyed it quite a bit. I'll be sad to see this series end. But then, I like endings and comics aren't often good at ending. Like ever.
I never finished Fraction's run. I had to drop some books and for some reason decided to drop Iron fist during the martial arts tourney run. I had been stockpiling the second arc because I wanted to read it all in one run because I did not like the first arc separated up month to month. Needless to say as soon as I finished the second arc I regretted missing 3 issues following it! But yes, his Iron Fist was flawless.
And I was in Rocket Ship a bunch this weekend while I was visiting my brother! Nice little shop there.
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My only complaint about the third Iron Fist trade is that it seems to collect a bunch of specials and random issues. Still, a very good run overall. I came to it late, so I had two whole trades to read at once, which was nice.
Rocket Ship is my favorite comic shop in New York. I don't get over there as often as I should. I also missed Chris Onstad who was there a few months ago.
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So I just got done reading a bunch of stuff as well:
Top Ten Season 1 and Top Ten: The 49ers. I think this was some of the most amazing superhero comics I've ever read; just brilliant writing from Moore - really human characters, fun, interesting stories and some really great emotional moments, especially in the 49ers. I know that I shouldn't be surprised because it's Alan Moore, but I don't think I've had this much fun reading a superhero comic in ages (New Frontier maybe?) which is kind of sad. It's probably a more of a reflection on current superhero comics than anything else though.
Top 10 is great! I have yet to read volume 2 but I picked volume 1 up a few years ago when I was literally buying a trade a week and needed something completely new. Very cool concept. I am interested to check out some more of Moore's ABC Line (especially Promethea. Love JH Williams III's art!)
Those Iron Fist books are awesomely good. I just read the third one the other night. I'm on the fence as to whether or not I should continue with it as Matt Fraction is leaving it/has left it. I've been following it in trades, so I read it at a delay. Anyone like the new guy?
And Scott Pilgrim 5 is very very good. Bryan Lee O'Malley was at a signing at Rocket Ship here in Brooklyn this past Wednesday. I did not know about it at all, but stopped by the shop on Thursday to find out that not only were they sold out but I'd missed a signing! Anyway, picked it up yesterday and enjoyed it quite a bit. I'll be sad to see this series end. But then, I like endings and comics aren't often good at ending. Like ever.
I never finished Fraction's run. I had to drop some books and for some reason decided to drop Iron fist during the martial arts tourney run. I had been stockpiling the second arc because I wanted to read it all in one run because I did not like the first arc separated up month to month. Needless to say as soon as I finished the second arc I regretted missing 3 issues following it! But yes, his Iron Fist was flawless.
And I was in Rocket Ship a bunch this weekend while I was visiting my brother! Nice little shop there.
I'm following Iron Fist in trades but I've heard that Swierczynski hasn't missed a beat since he started on the title.
As far as Moore's other ABC titles, I've got one more volume of Promethea to go. The art is amazing, Williams does so many different styles and pulls them all off. The actual story is ok, but its more of a a lecture about Moore's beliefs about life and magic (magik?) than anything which is the kind of thing that usually bores me. Other than that I've read some of the Tom Strong stuff which was ok but nothing memorable and League of Extraordinary Gentlemen which is fantastic, although I haven't read the Black Dossier. Overall though I think Top Ten was the best book that came out from ABC.
And Scott Pilgrim was sold out everywhere I went on Monday! Hopefully I'll be able to get a copy next week.
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Tom mentioned in the show last night that there's a nod to The Best Show in Fraction's X-Men. Which issue is it, I'd love to check it out.
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Fraction follow-up:
Full panel:
(http://www.mattfraction.com/+posts/xshow.jpg) (http://mattfraction.com/?p=1992)
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Scott Pilgrim 5 is great but it's also pretty sad compared to the other ones, which a lot of my friends kind of hated. They've been filming the movie here so everyone's rushing around trying to finish it before the press starts - 'cause if you can't say you read it before it was popular, there's no point, right?
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I've never read any of them, but I'm sure I would probably maybe like them. I like his O'Malley's music enough for what it is, so I figure I'll like his comics too. I better get on it though soon so I can be one of the cool kids too.
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Oh, Rob Liefeld, what are we going to do with you? You fucking idiot.
(http://i.newsarama.com/images/yb09p18.jpg)
(http://i.newsarama.com/images/yb09p19.jpg)
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Was Marvel bought by the Democratic party? I thought the majority of their comics were shitty enough, but then they started doing all this Obama-humping.
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Oh, Rob Liefeld, what are we going to do with you? You fucking idiot.
Wow that's so awful it actually trumps how insane and awful this is:
http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2009/05/i-guess-the-punishers-not-a-fan-of-rap-music/
Notice how eerily photo-reffed Eminem's face is, while the rest of the art just looks like regular comic art.
Comics - redefining rock bottom every Wednesday!
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I got my free Green Lantern comic this past Saturday. I thought it was pretty good, but it also reminded me why I don't buy contemporary superhero comics anymore.
I also read MW (http://tezukainenglish.com/?q=node/46), by manga giant Osamu Tezuka recently. It was good: lurid, violent, perverse, and substantial (something like 700 pages). I don't really read manga on a regular basis, and there are some conventions that I find a little confusing, but I think this book stacks up well against any of the modern "for mature readers" Vertigo-type books.
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I've been working my way through the fantastic DC Kirby reprints. I just got volume 4 of the New Gods (the last one!) and I am loving it. The man was just all sorts of crazy genius. I can't get enough. Next up is the Demon, OMAC, and Kamandi. I'm saving Kamandi for last mostly because of that insane map of the world.
I also got a book of Winsor McKay editorial cartoons on FCBD that's pretty sweet. As much as I don't like editorial cartoons, that's balanced out by my insane love for McKay. (I've been thinking about getting a Nemo tattoo for about a year).
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Also, did anyone think Northstar saying someone "seemed like a good enough sort" in the newest UXM was a Best Show reference? anyone? Anyone?
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Oh, Rob Liefeld, what are we going to do with you? You fucking idiot.
Notice how eerily photo-reffed Eminem's face is, while the rest of the art just looks like regular comic art.
Kind of like that one Bugs Bunny cartoon where him and Elmer Fudd are waiters at a Hollywood restaurant, or something.
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I've been working my way through the fantastic DC Kirby reprints. I just got volume 4 of the New Gods (the last one!) and I am loving it. The man was just all sorts of crazy genius. I can't get enough. Next up is the Demon, OMAC, and Kamandi. I'm saving Kamandi for last mostly because of that insane map of the world.
I've just gotten the first New Gods book, so far. I haven't quite been able to convince myself to shell out for the others, although Amazon has them for a pretty good price. It really is bizarre. But I've also been reading the Showcase Presents Legion reprints, and they're just as insane. Jim Shooter was 13 when he was hired for that series! That's what the comics industry needs now - more teenage writers.
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They are frustratingly expensive, but they're also really really nicely presented (and recolored!). I was resistant for a long time until I got a TPB of the first bit of the Jimmy Olsen run and was totally hooked. All the extras in the back are pretty cool too, especially the original pencils.
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Do any of those New Gods collections contain The Hunger Dogs graphic novel? I've been looking for that fucker for years and years.
Darkseid is.
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Do any of those New Gods collections contain The Hunger Dogs graphic novel? I've been looking for that fucker for years and years.
I hear it's awful, but yeah, I'm pretty curious about it too.
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I hear it's awful, but yeah, I'm pretty curious about it too.
Yes. I've read all the Kirby New Gods stuff but the Hunger Dogs and even though I also hear it is petty bad, I've been looking for it too long to just write if off.
After reading this on wikipedia
"Published as DC Graphic Novel #4, The Hunger Dogs was intended by Kirby and DC to serve as the end to the entire Fourth World saga. However, the project was mired in controversy over Kirby's insistence that the series should end with the deaths of the New Gods, which clashed with DC's demands that the New Gods could not be killed off.
As a result, production of the graphic novel suffered many delays and revisions. Pages and storyline elements from the never published "On the Road to Armagetto" were revised and incorporated into the graphic novel, while DC ordered the entire plot restructured, resulting in many pages of the story being rearranged out of Kirby's intended reading order",
I can't wait to read this mess, if I ever find a copy.
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Yep, Hunger Dogs is in the Volume 4! I'm working my way towards it. I'm past the point where everything but Miracle Man was cancelled. It's kind of sad.
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It is a bummer. I just read this set of cheap black & white editions of the Fourth World comics -- like the Essentials or Showcase series, but a sort of prototype version -- and those late issues of Mr. Miracle feel like a TV show that's constantly trying to reboot. All kinds of weird nonsense angles, plus some ideas that would later come into his 70s stuff like OMAC, Kamandi, The Demon, Devil Dinosaur, The Eternals, Machine Man, 2001, or Captain America & The Falcon. Actually that's my favorite Kirby era.
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I agree. I like some of the end of the Mister Miracle stuff, probably partially because it's hard for me to not like Kirby, but it really feels like he's flailing around. The wedding issue is surreal in the 30-second wrapup of everything at top speed. Evanier talks about this a little in one of his (fascinating) essays at the end of one of the volumes.
Speaking of Mister Miracle, I got his Kirby New Gods action figures on a whim at FCBD for $6. Man, that thing kind of sucks. It LOOKS like a Kirby drawing (in terms of lines and such), but it's in such a static pose and is completely unposable, which is so disappointing for something based on a dude with such crazy hyperenergetic art. Oh well, I should have known better. (Is action figures even the acceptable term? I haven't bought one since TMNT when I was six.)
On an unrelated note, has anyone seen Tales Designed to Thrizzle #5 in an LCS? I know I can get it from Fantagraphics, and I'm tempted because my local STILL doesn't have it in stock.
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On an unrelated note, has anyone seen Tales Designed to Thrizzle #5 in an LCS? I know I can get it from Fantagraphics, and I'm tempted because my local STILL doesn't have it in stock.
I think that their stuff is available from Fanta directly for some weeks before it's released to shops. But in any case, haven't seen it at my LCS, and I never will, because the place is a dumb shithole. (grrrr.... I've complained about this repeatedly on this thread, so sorry for the repetition, but it really irks me that as someone who likes many different types of comics, I can never find anything of interest at the place.)
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On an unrelated note, has anyone seen Tales Designed to Thrizzle #5 in an LCS? I know I can get it from Fantagraphics, and I'm tempted because my local STILL doesn't have it in stock.
I think that their stuff is available from Fanta directly for some weeks before it's released to shops. But in any case, haven't seen it at my LCS, and I never will, because the place is a dumb shithole. (grrrr.... I've complained about this repeatedly on this thread, so sorry for the repetition, but it really irks me that as someone who likes many different types of comics, I can never find anything of interest at the place.)
If the comics won't come to you, you must go to the comics.
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Just finished Black Hole by Charles Burns, and I was really surprised at how much I liked it. It was like all the weird/surreal/creepy stuff I hate in Dan Clowes comics, but for some reason I couldn't get enough and blew through it in an afternoon. Felt really unsettled the whole time. Recommended (if you like weird creepy stuff).
Also finished the New Gods Volume 4. The Armaghetto and Hunger Dogs stories weren't... BAD, but they sure weren't up to his normal par. Some of the inking is pretty shitty and really saps a lot of the "crackle" from Kirby's art, which is suffering on its own (not that there's anything wrong with that, he was pushing 120 when he did the book). There's still some really great stuff in there, but nothing compared to his Fourth World peaks in Volume 1 and 2.
Next up are the 2 Walt and Skeezix collections (1921-22 and 1925-26). I've read about 1/4 of the first one, and it's pretty wonderful and heartwarming.
Yes. I've read all the Kirby New Gods stuff but the Hunger Dogs and even though I also hear it is petty bad, I've been looking for it too long to just write if off.
If you promise to send it back, I'll send you the Vol 4 hardcover so you can read it without laying out the $50. PM me your address if you want.
Groteface Killah - OMAC and The Demon are next up on my list. I love the Kirby 2001. I think most of the appeal is thinking about Kubrick reading it and going "What the FUCK? What the fuck is this?????"
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Next up are the 2 Walt and Skeezix collections (1921-22 and 1925-26). I've read about 1/4 of the first one, and it's pretty wonderful and heartwarming.
Yeah, the art is really amazing. And if you look at today's newspaper comics... well, they don't stack up too well against this century-old stuff.
But the jokes - for 6 months after Skeezix first turns up, all the jokes are based on the "you think we're talking about cars, but in the last panel you'll see we're talking about a baby" formula. After that, the writing improves significantly.
Also, pete, are you a gazillionaire? My god, you've got an expensive comic book hobby!
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Ha, no, I'm pretty
cheap frugal in most other areas of my life, which lets me buy stuff I like when I feel like it. Also, I get a lot of stuff on sale/discounted/etc (the Walt+Skeezix books were half off when I got them). Also, I just got dumped, so I've been buying stuff to make myself feel better (note: not working). Also.... whatever, I'm allowed.
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Sorry to hear about the break-up. You certainly are allowed! I'm just a little jealous, that's all.
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Hm, re-reading that last line, it looks snottier and less jokey than I meant. Just to be clear.
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What are people's thoughts on Wednesday Comics? I'm pretty darned excited myself. Great creative teams, unique idea, and I'm there!
Also, trying to decide what big collection I want to get next, The 3 Frank Miller Daredevil Visionaries or something along the lines of some other "classic" Marvel stories. Any recommendations?
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Very excited for Wednesday Comics, in a way I haven't been for anything Marvel or DC in several years (probably pre-Didio and definitely pre-House of M). Way to get to me to buy men in their underwears again, DC.
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Thanks for bringing Wednesday Comics to my attention. This sounds like a great idea, though I'm a little skeptical of the one page format (even if it is a BIG page).
Anyone remember the Action Comics Weekly fiasco? It was similar. And it was pretty shitty.
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I'd feel the same way about Wednesday Comics, Bryan, if the list of talent wasn't top-damn-notch. It's also being edited by Mark Chiarello, who was the guy behind DC's awesome SOLO series a couple years back. There's a bunch of preview pages out there already. The Kamandi one is pretty sick.
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As is this GL one:
(http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/wc2greenlantern2.jpg)
Hubba hubba!
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The talent is pretty exciting. It may become the first non-reprint superhero comic I've bought in.... eight years, maybe? Longer?
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What are people's thoughts on Wednesday Comics? I'm pretty darned excited myself. Great creative teams, unique idea, and I'm there!
Also, trying to decide what big collection I want to get next, The 3 Frank Miller Daredevil Visionaries or something along the lines of some other "classic" Marvel stories. Any recommendations?
I'm really looking forward to it, so much so that I might buy it weekly. Has been a long time since I bought a comic in non-collected format. Although I do like the idea of having it collected in a big Kramers Ergot type book, it seems like it will be fun to get it in weekly installments.
The book that I'm looking forward to most though is Darwyn Cooke's take on 'The Hunter'. I love his work so much I want to take it out to a steak dinner. Preview is here: http://www.idwpublishing.com/previews/parker/ (http://www.idwpublishing.com/previews/parker/)
In terms of classic stuff, I've just started with Simonson's Thor run, which is pretty awesome so far. It's been a while since I've read any superhero stuff and this hit the spot. Not much of the "tis" and "thou" type talk which had always put me off reading Thor. The Beta Ray Bill story alone is worth the cost of a book.
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In terms of classic stuff, I've just started with Simonson's Thor run, which is pretty awesome so far. It's been a while since I've read any superhero stuff and this hit the spot. Not much of the "tis" and "thou" type talk which had always put me off reading Thor. The Beta Ray Bill story alone is worth the cost of a book.
Oh! Speaking of quality Thor runs, I guess they just announced a collected edition of the first year or so of Dan Jurgens's and John Romita Jr.'s Thor run from the late 90s. I was only like 10 when they came out but remember thinking "WOW. So THIS is how you make Thor cool!" Some fantastic stories in that run. I'd suggest checking it out when they release it.
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I have been hopelessly and completely excited about Wednesday Comics. Most of my interest in recent years has been with early strips, but I have a strong affection for the DC characters, so the whole project is very exciting and has helped remind me why I love comics. I think the fact that it will only run for 12 weeks has helped calm any concern over things running out of steam too quickly or someone dropping the ball along the way.
Bring it!
What are people's thoughts on Wednesday Comics? I'm pretty darned excited myself. Great creative teams, unique idea, and I'm there!
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The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Century: 1910 was pretty fantastic. Alan Moore has a really big hard on for the Three Penny Opera, though, doesn't he?
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Sad news, even though I rarely go there these days:
NoReply@zcultfm.com show details 12:28 PM (11 hours ago)
Dear Cultist, I have decided that within the next few weeks Z-Cult FM will be slowly closed down and the server put offline resulting in the death of Z-Cult FM as we know it. Z-Cult FM was born in 2004 and over the last 5 years has seen many high and low times. I would like to thank everyone who was involved over the last 5 years in making Z-Cult FM what it became. I would personally like to thank all the staff past and present, all torrenters and supporters of the site. I did start listing everyone by name but the list was too big and was scared I would miss someone off. Thanks to everyone who posted and helped out in any way possible. I would also like to unthank all the people who during the 5 years have caused trouble for the site such as no-ip, Marvel, DC Comics, etc etc list goes on..... least you made Z-Cult FM into a soap opera with many dramas along the way. The future for Z-Cult FM is currently a sad quiet death and a think about it's future. If it does return it will be just as a message board for the members who still like to use it but we will see what future holds. Thanks, Serj R.I.P. Z-Cult FM 2004 - 2009
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Has anyone here ever heard of Drifting Classroom? 70's Japanese horror comics are so, so great.
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The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Century: 1910 was pretty fantastic. Alan Moore has a really big hard on for the Three Penny Opera, though, doesn't he?
I enjoyed that a lot, but I think I would have gotten more out of it if I knew more (slash anything) about the cultural references he's making. I felt the same way about Black Dossier. I could follow along with most of Vols 1/2, but after that, I got a little lost.
Also, as a rule, i really don't like music in comics, I don't think I've ever seen it done in a way that makes any sense to my brain (though clearly others feel differently, so i'm willing to accept that it's a personal thing).
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Ok, I just took 2 longboxes to a (not my primary) LCS, and they offered me $60 for two full longboxes, which obviously I wasn't that into. So some chunks are going on eBay, and I'm going to give the rest away for free. Watch this space!
*update*
Ok, the for-sale list is up here if anyone wants to jump on that with an offer pre-ebay : http://tinyurl.com/pnf9f5 (links to PDF)
I've also got a full longbox of free comics I'm giving out. I'll be splitting them randomly between everyone that wants some. DM me with your address if you want in. You get a double-share if you send me something, literally anything interesting you want, but this isn't required.
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Wha? Huh?
(http://www.fantagraphics.com/images/flog/67/jasonspidey2.jpg)
Marvel Comics is proud to announce the release of Strange Tales MAX #1 (of 3) in September 2009, featuring the most acclaimed creators in independent comics today! This landmark three issue limited series, overflowing with 48 pages of all new stories, features your favorite Marvel heroes-from Spider-Man to the Hulk-like you've never seem them before! Paul Pope, Peter Bagge, Molly Crabapple & John Leavitt, Junko Mizuno, Dash Shaw, James Kochalka, Johnny Ryan, Michael Kupperman, Nick Bertozzi, Nicholas Gurewich, Jason and more unite for the all-new Strange Tales MAX!
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That looks pretty good to me. This sort of thing has been tried before -- Bagge did a Spider-Man comic, and DC did a couple of those Bizarro hardcovers of indie comics guys doing DC characters. Like any anthology, Bizarro was hit or miss, but I'm definitely getting this.
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Very excited for this. It was announced originally back in like, 2002! Glad to see it finally being released.
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Very excited for this. It was announced originally back in like, 2002! Glad to see it finally being released.
Yeah I was about to say, I've seen a lot of this stuff before haven't I?
And I have!
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I met Lowell Cunningham at a birthday party. Anybody know him? Seemed like a nice guy, kind of quiet.
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That looks pretty good to me. This sort of thing has been tried before -- Bagge did a Spider-Man comic, and DC did a couple of those Bizarro hardcovers of indie comics guys doing DC characters. Like any anthology, Bizarro was hit or miss, but I'm definitely getting this.
The Incorrigible Hulk, which was meant to be his follow-up to The Megalomaniacal Spider-Man, is finally coming out in serialized form in these comics. At this point I had assumed I'd never end up seeing it, so that alone would get me to buy it (fortunately, the other talent assembled is unbelievable, too).
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Did anyone else pick up Asterios Polyp? It's.... incredible.
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Just got the first and second issues of Chew. Pretty interesting.
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Invisibles
Wanted
Marvel Zombies
Y the Last Man
The Scribbler
Rob Zombie's Spookshow International
Tick
I read a bunch of others, but these come to mind.
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Invisibles
Wanted
Marvel Zombies
Y the Last Man
The Scribbler
Rob Zombie's Spookshow International
Tick
I read a bunch of others, but these come to mind.
Is that Rob Zombie book any good? I just got Greek Street and was unimpressed.
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Spookshow is a lot like Devils Rejects and House Of 1000 Corpses. It is full of reoccurring characters also.
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Just got the first and second issues of Chew. Pretty interesting.
Man, you found a copy of issue 1? Lucky you.
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Just got the first and second issues of Chew. Pretty interesting.
Man, you found a copy of issue 1? Lucky you.
Yeah, I got 2 first and then 1 was in my hold this past Wednesday. I was stoked and it was pretty good.
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I just flipped through Wednesday Comics, and was inspired to log on to say Thanks! to whoever mentioned it here. It probably would have completely passed me by if you hadn't! I haven't read it, but it sure looks nice. The printing is beautiful, and there's some amazing artwork, too.
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I just flipped through Wednesday Comics, and was inspired to log on to say Thanks! to whoever mentioned it here. It probably would have completely passed me by if you hadn't! I haven't read it, but it sure looks nice. The printing is beautiful, and there's some amazing artwork, too.
You're welcome! I haven't read it yet myself. I REALLY hope they collect this in a huge hardcover format with nicer paper when all's said and done. Kind of like the new Little Nemo in Slumberland hardcovers coming out. Those things are HUGE and SO nice.
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Anyone on this thread read X-men Forever? I just heard an interview with Clairmont, sounds interesting.
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I can't read Claremont. The whammos and slammos bug me for some reason.
Oh, and I basically said the same things I've said before about that piece of shit Young Liars comic book when someone was bemoaning its demise. Their response to my criticism made me laugh:
Well one issue is hardly giving it a chance and Stray Bullets is by far his best stuff. But I'd be well and sure that would go over your head too being that the story line takes place mostly in late 70's and early 80's if 94 is a way back machine for you. Far as Lapham being a "virgin", whether that be your petty juvenile attack at the man with wife and kids or just ignorance of the fact he is a multiple Eisner winner, doesn't hold up. It's no surprise you're not a fan while you blanket yourself with that type of immaturity. Its easy for the shallow to disregard depth and substance.
L. O. L.
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I can't read Claremont. The whammos and slammos bug me for some reason.
Oh, and I basically said the same things I've said before about that piece of shit Young Liars comic book when someone was bemoaning its demise. Their response to my criticism made me laugh:
Well one issue is hardly giving it a chance and Stray Bullets is by far his best stuff. But I'd be well and sure that would go over your head too being that the story line takes place mostly in late 70's and early 80's if 94 is a way back machine for you. Far as Lapham being a "virgin", whether that be your petty juvenile attack at the man with wife and kids or just ignorance of the fact he is a multiple Eisner winner, doesn't hold up. It's no surprise you're not a fan while you blanket yourself with that type of immaturity. Its easy for the shallow to disregard depth and substance.
L. O. L.
Wow, it sounds just like Marc Maron trying to explain his comedy.
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Marc Maron is the Dane Cook of Richard Lewis's humor.
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I can't really stand claremont's dialogue, but man, the dude had an undeniable influence on what we think of as superhero comics today.
Also, Laurie, Young Liars is *really really really* good. I would give it another shot. I definitely didn't appreciate it after one issue, but the story is like, the ultimate unreliable narrator story, and it's really interesting to see how the story melts and folds around itself depending on who's narrating and what mental state they're in. I really like how the 'Oh, THAT'S what's really going on!' changes issue by issue, and Lapham is an incredibly talented storyteller/cartoonist, so I think it works really well. I think there's 2 trades out now for maybe ten apeice? If you want, I'll mail you my copies and you can read them for free.
Did anyone else get Asterios Polyp yet? It's gotten almost universal praise to the point of being boring to keep hearing about it, but it is just a phenomenal work from an insanely talented dude.
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Did anyone else get Asterios Polyp yet? It's gotten almost universal praise to the point of being boring to keep hearing about it, but it is just a phenomenal work from an insanely talented dude.
I still haven't, but once I get a big chunk of change, that's near the top of my list.
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So, a friend of mine let me flip through the new Batman: The Widening Gyre by king of the shore trash Kevin Smith and drawn by one of his cronies Walt Flanagin. I don't know what I was expecting but I did think that he would respect the characters that are older than he is by not adding pieces of his Askewniverse to it but sure enough 2 pages in there is an uncharacteristic Spongebob reference and in the same panel there are all these products in the background from his movies like Nails cigarettes and a bunch of other bullshit. Oh and the whole scene is taking place in a convenience store, how groundbreaking for Kevin Smith. If he wants to write comics then why can't he stick to his characters? Let the stoners read his stuff and leave the real super heroes to real writers.
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Did you read the first three issues of BATMAN AND ROBIN though? Because it's fast becoming some of my favorite comic book-ing I've ever seen. I'm a huge Morrison fan, and an even bigger fan when he's paired up with Quitely.
I'm pretty leery of Philip Tan's upcoming issues, because I really was not a fan of his work on GREEN LANTERN at all, really muddy I thought. And that's my only experience with him. Although I have seen some pictures of his pencils, and they look pretty good. I don't know why they can't find a good inker/colorist to pair with him. Regardless, with Morrison writing, it'll still be stellar, I'm sure.
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I think quitely is getting better and better on every project. Someone on twitter said issue #3 was worth it for the two "BANG"s in blood when the officers' heads exploded. Pyg's insanity is really kind of terrifying and I love Morrison's concept of someone with a real legitimate fucked up mental illness. Kind of like what he was doing with the Joker back in Batman. I don't remember the line exactly, but he mentioned his concept of the Joker being like, the guy who sits just a little too close to you on the subway, and gets off at the same station as you and silently follows you home and stares unblinking at your bedroom window from across the street all night.
It'd be hard to convince me that Morrison isn't the best mainstream comics writer working now by far, and *possibly* of all time. Dude literally changed the way I think about the world.
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I think quitely is getting better and better on every project. Someone on twitter said issue #3 was worth it for the two "BANG"s in blood when the officers' heads exploded. Pyg's insanity is really kind of terrifying and I love Morrison's concept of someone with a real legitimate fucked up mental illness. Kind of like what he was doing with the Joker back in Batman. I don't remember the line exactly, but he mentioned his concept of the Joker being like, the guy who sits just a little too close to you on the subway, and gets off at the same station as you and silently follows you home and stares unblinking at your bedroom window from across the street all night.
It'd be hard to convince me that Morrison isn't the best mainstream comics writer working now by far, and *possibly* of all time. Dude literally changed the way I think about the world.
I am in awe of the use of onomatopoeia in the art. They're all so clever. I wonder if Tan and Irving are going to continue that quirk. I don't think it'll work with Tan's art. But we'll see. Quitely's next three issues can't come soon enough.
I've never seen that description of the Joker, but I definitely do love Morrison's take on his and Batman's history. How all of the things in Bruce Wayne's life would affect him and account for his dramatic changes in personality and modus operandi throughout his publication history (kind of serious to camp to Miller-ized Goddamn Batman). And for the Joker, he just reinvents himself because of his "super-sanity."
I love the fact that Morrison is trying to add new rogues to Batman's gallery. Pyg is definitely interesting, but I have a feeling the next time we see him in a non-Morrison-written book, it'll come off too-weird-for-weird's-sake like a lot of Morrison's ideas when filtered through another person's head and pen. And I feel the same way. I really don't think I could be convinced of anybody else being a better Big Two writer than Morrison.
What else are you reading, Pete (and anybody reading the thread)?
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What else are you reading, Pete (and anybody reading the thread)?
I'm about a third of the way through J. Hernandez' 700+ page "Locas: The Maggie and Hopey Stories." I'm loving it. It's like Archie + Tintin with a soupcon of punk rock, soft porn and sci-fi.
I never got into Los Bros until very recently - the magnitude of their output always seemed too daunting. I like these big omnibus collections because it allows you to see the artist's growth in a really concrete way.
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Did you read the first three issues of BATMAN AND ROBIN though?
I haven't yet but I've been hearing great things on my comic podcasts.
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Anyone else pick up Strange Tales today? I think Pope's and Shaw's tied for best. I was very pleasantly surprised to see Gurewitch's pages!
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What else are you reading, Pete (and anybody reading the thread)?
I'm about a third of the way through J. Hernandez' 700+ page "Locas: The Maggie and Hopey Stories." I'm loving it. It's like Archie + Tintin with a soupcon of punk rock, soft porn and sci-fi.
I never got into Los Bros until very recently - the magnitude of their output always seemed too daunting. I like these big omnibus collections because it allows you to see the artist's growth in a really concrete way.
I've been meaning to read some of Los Bros' stuff, but honestly won't be able to get around to it for a good while (months at the least).
Did you read the first three issues of BATMAN AND ROBIN though?
I haven't yet but I've been hearing great things on my comic podcasts.
The great things you're hearing are on point, I'm sure. Get them as soon as you possibly can. eBay them if your store's sold out.
What comic podcasts do you listen to? I listen to Word Balloon when Fraction, Brubaker, and sometimes Bendis are on. And whatever random eps that I think might interesting.
Anyone else pick up Strange Tales today? I think Pope's and Shaw's tied for best. I was very pleasantly surprised to see Gurewitch's pages!
I ordered it. But I use Heroes Corner and get my stuff delivered bimonthly. And since this month is five weeks long, and I'll want to read B&R #4 as soon as possible and it comes out the third week of the month, I'll probably elect to get my first shipment then, so won't be reading it until the 18th or 19th.
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dnk I listen to Fanboy Radio, The Geek Show, and recently started listening to Robot Sweatshop. They are all based in the comic book world and seem to branch out to movies, TV, toys, etc... all things "nerdy". Robot Sweatshop is hosted by Dan from Brooklyn who recently did the Marvel interview with Tom.
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dnk I listen to Fanboy Radio, The Geek Show, and recently started listening to Robot Sweatshop. They are all based in the comic book world and seem to branch out to movies, TV, toys, etc... all things "nerdy". Robot Sweatshop is hosted by Dan from Brooklyn who recently did the Marvel interview with Tom.
I listened to the Robot Sweatshop ep with Barry Ludtnik. Which was basically them doing a S&W bit, with W being an old comic book writer slash hoodlum. It was pretty good.
I don't listen to too many podcasts in general, but the ones I do* are because it's stuff I like packaged in a podcast in a way I can't really get from anywhere else or something inane or untrue like that. I don't listen to comic-related ones because they're mostly reviews and news, right? Still stuff I'll just end up reading about on the Bendis Board sooner or later.
*If you actually want to know: The Best Show, Best Show Gems, All Songs Considered, Live Concerts from All Songs Considered, This American Life, and The Moth.
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dnk I listen to Fanboy Radio, The Geek Show, and recently started listening to Robot Sweatshop. They are all based in the comic book world and seem to branch out to movies, TV, toys, etc... all things "nerdy". Robot Sweatshop is hosted by Dan from Brooklyn who recently did the Marvel interview with Tom.
I listened to the Robot Sweatshop ep with Barry Ludtnik. Which was basically them doing a S&W bit, with W being an old comic book writer slash hoodlum. It was pretty good.
I don't listen to too many podcasts in general, but the ones I do* are because it's stuff I like packaged in a podcast in a way I can't really get from anywhere else or something inane or untrue like that. I don't listen to comic-related ones because they're mostly reviews and news, right? Still stuff I'll just end up reading about on the Bendis Board sooner or later.
*If you actually want to know: The Best Show, Best Show Gems, All Songs Considered, Live Concerts from All Songs Considered, This American Life, and The Moth.
Yeah, the RS bits are very S&W but they manage to keep it funny so I don't mind but I like their panel eps a lot. The reason I listen to so many pocasts is I have 9 hours a day at work to fill. I usually listen to podcasts for the first 5 hours and music for the last 4 but when I'm home I hang out with my kids until they go to bed. My daughter just started getting into comics, it's so cool to see her eyes light up when I bring home a new Muppet Show or Tick. You do have a great pocast list. The only one on your list I don't listen to is All Songs Considered.
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I'm thinking of ordering the new Mirage Studios 608 page collection of the first year or so of the original Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles run by Eastman/Laird. Anybody read this? I kinda read the first two or three issues a few years back and it seemed pretty good. As a fan of the first film and loving them as a kid I'd love to know if this collection is worth the 35 bucks if anybody here has read the stories.
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I've read the first two trades of The Invisibles by Grant Morrison. So far, I'm not too into it. I'm just wondering if there is more payoff that I should keep reading or should I stop now and save some money.
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I'd stick with the Invisibles at least for a couple more volumes. It's Morrison's weirdest 'mainstream' work for sure, and takes a while to ramp up. I like the first couple OK, but it really suffers from the almost universally shitty early-Vertigo art and coloring. (as much as I really love Jill Thompson's and Steve Yeowell's work now, I reaaaaally can't deal with the work they did here). Once it gets running with consistently good artists, I think there's some really interesting work in there and a lot of classic Morrison style crazyideas.
On the other hand, if you're not into Morrison's weird-brain magic-y side, it might not be the series for you. I mean, it gets really weird.
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I'd stick with the Invisibles at least for a couple more volumes. It's Morrison's weirdest 'mainstream' work for sure, and takes a while to ramp up. I like the first couple OK, but it really suffers from the almost universally shitty early-Vertigo art and coloring. (as much as I really love Jill Thompson's and Steve Yeowell's work now, I reaaaaally can't deal with the work they did here). Once it gets running with consistently good artists, I think there's some really interesting work in there and a lot of classic Morrison style crazyideas.
On the other hand, if you're not into Morrison's weird-brain magic-y side, it might not be the series for you. I mean, it gets really weird.
Thanks, pete, I think I'll stick with it. I like the magic-y aspect of the comic and the characters are certainly interesting enough. I guess my problem was the story seemed rather shaggy and all over the place. But yeah, I'll give it more time.
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I am a complete comic novice but I picked up Black Hole by Charles Burns after hearing it discussed on Marc Maron's podcast and I really liked it.
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Can somebody explain the appeal of super hero comics to middle aged men i dont get it?
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Can somebody explain the appeal of super hero comics to middle aged men i dont get it?
read astonishing x-men volume 3 and see how you feel
also i should mention that this is coming from someone who doesnt really read comics
and also i originally came here to ask 'what is good as astonishing x-men volume 3'
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I've read the first two trades of The Invisibles by Grant Morrison. So far, I'm not too into it. I'm just wondering if there is more payoff that I should keep reading or should I stop now and save some money.
I wasn't crazy about it at all until I got to volume three. I'd say stick with it, but if moneys tight and you are looking for bang for your buck, you could always pick up a quicker Grant Morrison read. Volumes 2 and 3 of Animal Man are maybe the best things he has ever written, and fairly cheap.
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As a comics fan who isn't quite middle aged yet, I can say that for me it's a combination of things. For one thing, I've read them on and off since I was a kid, and I enjoy the entire format. In addition to that, the medium as a whole has evolved now to where many of them are written for an adult audience. Book's like Grant Morrison's Batman R.I.P. or Alan Moore's run on Supreme have deconstructed and reassembled the superhero genre to the point where some books can be very challenging on more than a few levels to read. There are more than a few books that are superhero books that I still read, if only because I find the story interesting and suspenseful. Greg Rucka, Fraction, Brubaker, Morrison, Vaughn... these guys all have CHOPS. It should be no surprise that lots of these guys are getting tapped to write for other media, nor should it be a surprise that a lot of them choose to keep one foot in comics. Not to mention that the artwork in most of their books is incredible.
There are still more simplistic superhero books that I read, too. Kirkman's Invincible is a good example, or Bendis' New Avengers are good examples. I don't think the storylines are anything complex or highly developed, but both writers have a great sense of storytelling and and a penchant for dialogue.
Also, a lot of it might come from my being a huge nerd. Either way, they seem to be more and more a part of the collective pop culture. Unlike the bulk of our pop culture, there are comic books that can be decidedly high brow.
or, I guess to put it a different way, can someone explain to me the appeal of Two and a Half Men to middle-aged men?
re: Grant Morrison
I really liked The Invisibles, but it definitely takes some getting used to. Peyote might help. For some reason, I tried to read Filth first and it really confused the hell out of me. As far as his other works, I'd recommend his Doom Patrol stuff, All-Star Superman, or We3.
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Attention comic nerds:
why do you like/not like DC Comics vs Marvel comics? What's good/not good about what each does? I am curious.
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why do you like/not like DC Comics vs Marvel comics? What's good/not good about what each does? I am curious.
DC is American League (or Yankees) and Marvel is National League (Mets).
DC is Warner Brothers and Marvel is Hanna Barbera.
DC is Disney World and Marvel is Great Adventure.
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why do you like/not like DC Comics vs Marvel comics? What's good/not good about what each does? I am curious.
DC is American League (or Yankees) and Marvel is National League (Mets).
This one I get .... can you go in to more specifics?
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Personally, I don't know. I mean, they different sets of characters and themes, and historically, DC has been a bit goofier than Marvel, but they both have their strong points.
Lots of DC characters were created across a number of different publishers which were eventually bought out by DC and incorporated into the same universe. Marvel's characters were all created in-house by a handful of people with a common editorial staff and house art style.
DC uses fictional town names loosely based on real ones, where Marvel uses real places.
DC has metahumans, Marvel has superhumans.
DC had the whole concept of "multiple earths" although I think Marvel has something resembling this now.
Marvel has the whole mutant thing (as opposed to the characters that were somehow empowered by some accident) cornered.
Marvel has more group books
I don't know, I think a lot of it has to do with following the goings on in one universe or another, and people just tend to stick with one over the other. Personally, I don't get it, although I tend to follow creators more than characters or publishers. I think in recent history, that stuff isn't as prevalent. Each company has adopted the devices of the other, and the talent is a lot quicker about going back and forth between the companies. But then, I'm sure there's dozens of people who could explain the difference better than I can.
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I think you are getting all the basic ideas but simplifying it quite a bit. Both companies tend towards themes.
DC's usually being more fantastic and escapist, usually taking on more surreal or philosophical human ideals, which is why DC's characters aren't really characters, they are more living embodiments of ideals. They do this pretty well very often, so you get to see the differences of the human Bruce Wayne and the pure fear the Batman represents.
Marvel on the other hand usually takes on more social or political issues when they do big event. The whole concept of Mutants takes on racial divides, and when it is handled well it translates perfectly. Everything since Civil War is clearly commentary on government control and public trust in those appointed to protect them. Because these are more real issues Marvel characters tend to be much less black and white, and more identifiable.
All of this can't be applied to everything the companies put out obviously, and a lot depends on the creative team that is working on the comic.
Maybe I'm analyzing it too much, but I think there are very different themes in Marvel and DC comics. The best of both companies can be really great in different ways and I follow several comics from each.
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Marvel on the other hand usually takes on more social or political issues when they do big event. The whole concept of Mutants takes on racial divides, and when it is handled well it translates perfectly. Everything since Civil War is clearly commentary on government control and public trust in those appointed to protect them. Because these are more real issues Marvel characters tend to be much less black and white, and more identifiable.
Back when I read comics Marvel seemed to require a little less suspension of disbelief.
The Hulk could move large pieces of land; Superman could move the earth in and out of its rotation (Somehow the fact that it was spinning didn't affect his ability to do so).
Marvel characters had complicated personal lives. D.C. characters barely had personal lives.
That's my remembrance.
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I don't know, Fredericks, I think Batman has a pretty complicated personal life.
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I don't know, Fredericks, I think Batman has a pretty complicated personal life.
Not back when I read him. He was just some rich guy who fought crime as a hobby. This was all pre-Dark Knight, you are reminded.
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The problem with most of my understanding is that I'm far more familiar with modern age stuff than what preceded it. One of those earlier books I'm most familiar with is that old Green Lantern/Green Lantern series from Neal Adams and Denny O'Neil where they deal with worker's rights, cults, heroin addiction, etc...
Yeah, speaking of complicated personal lives... both those characters work.
Like Dan said, every company has its off-theme series, but that's the one that always sticks out for me and it's as grounded in reality as a superhero comic can get.
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I think it has a lot to do with where both companies started. DC goes all the way back to the 1930s, when it was just pulp entertainment done by hacks for little kids, kind of like 80s cartoons, with the exception that there were some moments of accidental genius, like Jack Kirby. Marvel also existed then (as Timely Comics), but was a relatively minor company.
The real genius of Stan Lee in the 1960s was to combine superhero comics with romance comics, and elements of melodrama and realism, so characters like Spider-Man and The Fantastic Four seemed to have "real-world" problems. DC, by comparison, was going in a more space-age sci-fi direction, with high concept stories featuring wooden characters like The Flash, Green Lantern, and Adam Strange. Marvel's breakthroughs at the time became a bit of a countercultural phenomenon, with teen and college-age baby boomers identifying with underdog heroes like Spider-Man or The Hulk. Eventually these breakthroughs made stuff like Vertigo and "deconstructed" superheroes possible. Actual art comics for adults, Fantagraphics-like stuff, are more influenced by newspaper comics, fine art, pop culture, European comics, and 60s underground comix, but you can see some mainstream comics influence in the work of creators like Dan Clowes and Jaime Hernandez.
Today the big comic companies are indeed like sports teams, in that mercenary talent rotates between them -- the only difference between Grant Morrison on Batman and Grant Morrison on X-Men is the character background and brand identities he's working with.
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The real genius of Stan Lee in the 1960s was to combine superhero comics with romance comics, and elements of melodrama and realism, so characters like Spider-Man and The Fantastic Four seemed to have "real-world" problems.
That's why I preferred Marvel. Thanks Grote.
I have to read the New York Times now.
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I always thought of it as:
DC=Gods
Marvel=Men wanting to become gods through science.
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People act as if Marvel and DC are Democrats and Republicans. The future is in the independent parties.
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I like weird stuff. Not gross weird, not weird as in... "hey, that guy's a zombie"... not kitschy..
Heady weird.
I do not like super hero stuff.
Now I need recommendations.
I really liked that mnemovore. I got into "Y: The Last Man" at one point, but it was a bit campy for me sometimes.
The last actual super hero book I remember enjoying was years ago, "Wolverine: Inner Fury" - which was pretty different than your usual affair anyway - a lot darker and more self contained, a character piece.
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There are lots of recommendations earlier in the thread, but off the top of my head: Black Hole by Charles Burns (a little on the 'gross weird' side of things), Like a Velvet Glove Cast in Iron by Dan Clowes, Frank by Jim Woodring. All three have a psychedelic, disorienting tone. They're a little artier than "Y" and similar titles.
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I like weird stuff. Not gross weird, not weird as in... "hey, that guy's a zombie"... not kitschy..
Heady weird.
I do not like super hero stuff.
Now I need recommendations.
I really liked that mnemovore. I got into "Y: The Last Man" at one point, but it was a bit campy for me sometimes.
The last actual super hero book I remember enjoying was years ago, "Wolverine: Inner Fury" - which was pretty different than your usual affair anyway - a lot darker and more self contained, a character piece.
Daytrippers and Chew are weird non superhero books that I enjoy.
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Those are both amazing.
Scalped is great, but more Apache noir than weird.
Sweet Tooth would be another good one. It's still a young book, so I'm not sure how it'll end up, but I really like it so far.
Echo has been pretty fantastic, although I'm still getting over the sheer amount of physics in that last issue.
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I would recommend paging through Douglas Wolk's Reading Comics and going off his recommendations.
I'm currently enjoying collections of:
Queen & Country
Whiteout
Black Hole
Epileptic
Alias
Little Lulu
Tomb of Dracula
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Queen & Country is one of my favorite books ever written.
If you ever get the chance, check out The Sandbaggers, a British TV show that Rucka more or less based the series on.
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I'm reading Black Hole right now and loving it. Yesterday I also posed for a cover for one of the Marvel books of The Stand. I'll be the greaser/homoerotic rapist dude.
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MAN. are you ever gonna get out of that typecasting?
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MAN. are you ever gonna get out of that typecasting?
I know!
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Recent stuff I've enjoyed:
Grant Morrison's Batman and Robin. New readers definitely need context but I'm enjoying the new duo's dynamic.
Sean Murphy's art on Joe the Barbarian. (Link 1 (http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/6906/jtb001009.jpg), Link 2 (http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/8180/jtb001021022.jpg))
Brian K Vaughan's Ex Machina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_Machina_%28comics%29) is picking up in the home stretch.
The final issue of Warren Ellis' Planetary (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_%28comics%29).
Other stuff I've recently reread and continue to love:
Grant Morrison's Seven Soldiers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Soldiers). Seven intertwined 4-issue shorts. Genre hopping and amazing.
Warren Ellis' Nextwave (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nextwave). Cheeky.
Garth Ennis' cartoonishly violent run on Punisher.
Chris Ware's Acme Novelty Library #16-#19. Introspective and sad.
Adrian Tomine's Optic Nerve (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Tomine). Awkward and poignant.
First arc of Northlanders (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northlanders). Vikings!
Last year I bought my sister the coffee table book of Fables cover art by James Jean. (http://www.jamesjean.com/) It's wonderful.
I look like a total DC fanboy but I'm a Marvel kid, honest. Bendis' Daredevil/Alias and Millar's Ultimates are in my hall of fame.
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Recent stuff I've enjoyed:
I look like a total DC fanboy but I'm a Marvel kid, honest. Bendis' Daredevil/Alias and Millar's Ultimates are in my hall of fame.
This is awesome ... I'm reading a lot of DC/Vertigo stuff right now (Starting Y this weekend). I had no idea about all the GD Batman timelines.
What do people think about Jim Lee and Dan Didio now being publishers @ DC?
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I played poker the other night with Joe Matt (Peepshow, Spent, etc). I haven't read his books, but I intend to check them out. Nice dude, though. Also a Best Show fan and friend of Listener T.
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Joe Matt is brilliant, but you might not like him as much after you read his comics.
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Joe Matt is brilliant, but you might not like him as much after you read his comics.
Yea, he told me what they were about.
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[
I look like a total DC fanboy but I'm a Marvel kid, honest. Bendis' Daredevil/Alias and Millar's Ultimates are in my hall of fame.
[/quote]
The first two series of Millar's Ultimates I really like. Volume three i hated, and Jeph Loeb did it, who I thought I liked more than Millar (I checked out Wanted from the library and thought it was mean spirited and not fun at all). The whole Ultimatum thing i disliked in general, even though I bought most of it.
I like the new Bendis Spiderwoman a whole lot, but it seems like people within Marvel are having a lot of trouble keeping things straight. Yelena Belova shows up in that one as the team leader of the Thunderbolts, but she was only shown once in that series, in cryogenesis or something. That has really gone down hill as well. Is Songbird coming back?
And I'll buy anything that has Brian K Vaughan's name on it. Joss Whedon didn't totally ruin Runaways when he did the 19th century time line thing, but the guy after it certainly did. I love that series, and Y. Ex Machina I have just started getting into.
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I too love the candor of Joe Matt comics.
I think I may have ruined Bendis for myself by watching one of those motion comics for Spider-woman. People keep telling me it's good, but all I hear in my head when I read it is the dialogue/monologues read out loud by horrible actors.
A long time ago someone recommended to me this comic Fleep. Reading this thread made me want to reread it but it's at my mom's house. I googled it, however, and apparently it's online for free at the creator's website. Kinda small print but it's a fascinating tale about Russia, math and drinking urine that takes place entirely in one small room. Check it out. (http://www.shigabooks.com/strips/fleep/scrollindex.html) He also created a library-cop procedural called Bookhunter that is enjoyable but isn't as cerebral.
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Does anyone read Millar's Kick-Ass? The fanboy community has not stopped writhing in ecstasy over it and the upcoming movie makes them even more frantic in their praise. I'm wondering if it's worth checking out.
To me, the comic appears like it's trying too hard to be edgy and offbeat and the movie trailers look the same (ooh look, a young girl killing people!). Plus, I forget where, I read an article that said that almost all the bad guys in the comic are of color and there's a weird hint of racism in it.
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I stuck with Mark Millar during and right after his Grant Morrison collaborations, but somewhere in between Authority and Ultimates I kinda started to loathe everything he did.
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Ben, I think the art in the Spiderwoman series is amazing. I'm not sure I've ever seen Maleev color his own work, but the palette is spectacular. It bothers me that this whole thing is happening 15 months after it should've though. Marvel keeps dropping the ball with this stuff (Seige, Cap's return, Sentry's upcoming downfall at the hands of a kid) and it makes me wonder what the hell they're thinking. I guess DC has done it a bit, too, but Marvel really sticks out there.
I am one of the few that enjoyed Civil War and I enjoyed his run on the Authority, but for the most part, Millar misses with me. Oh, and the Old Man Logan thing was great up until the end. I started Kick Ass, but only got about 5 issues into it. Neat idea, just not really for me.
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I stuck with Mark Millar during and right after his Grant Morrison collaborations, but somewhere in between Authority and Ultimates I kinda started to loathe everything he did.
I think Kick-Ass is a solid story with good art. Most people disagree with me though.
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I think I may have ruined Bendis for myself by watching one of those motion comics for Spider-woman. People keep telling me it's good, but all I hear in my head when I read it is the dialogue/monologues read out loud by horrible actors.
Hadn't even heard of the motion comics until you mentioned it and I looked it up. Now I need to give it a try - one to recommend for itunes purchase?
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I have purchased some Matt Fraction stuff out of FOT loyalty, but I really can't afford comics. Podcasts saved me from the poor house.
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Hadn't even heard of the motion comics until you mentioned it and I looked it up. Now I need to give it a try - one to recommend for itunes purchase?
Haha. Can't say I love them, but you can get a taste on Hulu. Mind you, I only watched half of the first spider-woman one. Let me know if it gets better.
xhttp://www.hulu.com/spider-woman-agent-of-sword
xhttp://www.hulu.com/astonishing-x-men
Edit: ugh, I can't link to Hulu without it trying to embed the video, so copy and paste without the x.
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I stuck with Mark Millar during and right after his Grant Morrison collaborations, but somewhere in between Authority and Ultimates I kinda started to loathe everything he did.
I think Kick-Ass is a solid story with good art. Most people disagree with me though.
I haven't read Kick-Ass but I hope too soon. Millar's always been hit-or-miss for me. Loved - LOVED - "Wolverine: Enemy of the State," but really kind of hated Civil War.
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Does anyone read Millar's Kick-Ass? The fanboy community has not stopped writhing in ecstasy over it and the upcoming movie makes them even more frantic in their praise. I'm wondering if it's worth checking out.
To me, the comic appears like it's trying too hard to be edgy and offbeat and the movie trailers look the same (ooh look, a young girl killing people!). Plus, I forget where, I read an article that said that almost all the bad guys in the comic are of color and there's a weird hint of racism in it.
The thing about all the bad guys being black is not true, just the first few. The reason that all comic book nerds love it is because it takes place in this reality where there's no such thing as super powers and it's about a kid who just decides to put on a costume and fight crime. There isn't a comic book fan in the world who hasn't thought about that. I hear the movie follows the comic almost to the letter (with the exception of Red Mist's hair situation).
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The reason that all comic book nerds love it is because it takes place in this reality where there's no such thing as super powers and it's about a kid who just decides to put on a costume and fight crime. There isn't a comic book fan in the world who hasn't thought about that.
I can honestly say that I never have considered that. Now the RZA, that's a different story... (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/musicnightlife/2008007168_nite20.html)
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A friend of mine saw Michael Chabon in Seattle yesterday, and apparently he said Big Barda was a childhood crush of his. That makes me like him even more.
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Hadn't even heard of the motion comics until you mentioned it and I looked it up. Now I need to give it a try - one to recommend for itunes purchase?
Haha. Can't say I love them, but you can get a taste on Hulu. Mind you, I only watched half of the first spider-woman one. Let me know if it gets better.
xhttp://www.hulu.com/spider-woman-agent-of-sword
xhttp://www.hulu.com/astonishing-x-men
Edit: ugh, I can't link to Hulu without it trying to embed the video, so copy and paste without the x.
Whatever you do stay away from the Watchmen one. I've never listened to a book on CD, but if this is the kind of voice acting you get, count me out.
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The reason that all comic book nerds love it is because it takes place in this reality where there's no such thing as super powers and it's about a kid who just decides to put on a costume and fight crime. There isn't a comic book fan in the world who hasn't thought about that.
I can honestly say that I never have considered that. Now the RZA, that's a different story... (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/musicnightlife/2008007168_nite20.html)
I didn't mean that all comic book fans have thought about donning a costume and becoming vigilantes themselves. I was just thinking that most fans have thought about that scenario. It's basically Batman.
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The reason that all comic book nerds love it is because it takes place in this reality where there's no such thing as super powers and it's about a kid who just decides to put on a costume and fight crime. There isn't a comic book fan in the world who hasn't thought about that.
I can honestly say that I never have considered that. Now the RZA, that's a different story... (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/musicnightlife/2008007168_nite20.html)
I didn't mean that all comic book fans have thought about donning a costume and becoming vigilantes themselves. I was just thinking that most fans have thought about that scenario. It's basically Batman.
Yes, of course it's one of the most intense fantasies of most young superhero fans. How could it not be!?
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I'm really excited for Kick-Ass. THe comic was just over the top fun and I'm hearing great things about the movie so far in the first reviews. I think it's going to be a great time.
As for Fraction books, I was going to drop Uncanny a while back as I just needed to trim my pull list but I just COULDN'T drop it out of admiration of him being a frequent guest and I'm glad I did. Loving his Uncanny run right now (but bummed about "Second Coming" taking over the next few months) and am eagerly anticipating his Thor run and planning on catching up on Cassanova and Invincible Iron Man.
And am I the only "Invincible" reader on this board?
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And am I the only "Invincible" reader on this board?
well i refuse to die, but i think we're on a different page. GET IT?
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Is anybody reading the newer Bendis run of Ultimate Spiderman?
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Is anybody reading the newer Bendis run of Ultimate Spiderman?
Yes. I have bought them all so far - is it his job to tie up the loose ends of the Ultimatum debacle?
I really liked Mysterio and Kitty Pryde in it so far, though they have been ignored the past few issues. Which can be good thing, I like the three issue villain arc that many comics due once in a while, but not always.
I want more Shadowcat though, and soon.
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Is anybody reading the newer Bendis run of Ultimate Spiderman?
I read just about every issue of every Ultimate title up until Ultimatum and decided that was a good enough point to just end it. Because Ultimatum was trash. Plus I can't really dig David Lafuente's art.
I may pick up Ultimate Avengers in trades at some point, but I think Ultimate New Ultimates may be the dumbest title in comics right now. Poor Jeph Loeb...
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Is anybody reading the newer Bendis run of Ultimate Spiderman?
I read just about every issue of every Ultimate title up until Ultimatum and decided that was a good enough point to just end it. Because Ultimatum was trash. Plus I can't really dig David Lafuente's art.
I may pick up Ultimate Avengers in trades at some point, but I think Ultimate New Ultimates may be the dumbest title in comics right now. Poor Jeph Loeb...
I just got the new run of U. Spidey, they're only up to #8. Also got the first issue of Ultimate X. I like the art in that a lot. It'll be interesting to see where they go with that title.
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And am I the only "Invincible" reader on this board?
Nope. It's really an amazing book, goes to show how much fun a superhero book can be once you stop worrying about 40 years of continuity. Although I have to say I haven't read the last 3-4 issues or so.
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And am I the only "Invincible" reader on this board?
Nope. It's really an amazing book, goes to show how much fun a superhero book can be once you stop worrying about 40 years of continuity. Although I have to say I haven't read the last 3-4 issues or so.
Seriously, having a self contained universe (for the most part) is really refreshing. I am getting the hardcovers and getting one every 1.5-2 years REALLY sucks since I almost always forget what happened last (that and I'm about 30 issues behind the singles), but thanks to it being so contained I dont' have to worry about what I've missed. It comes back relatively easily.
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Has anyone read or is reading the Blackest Night series? What do you guys think of it? Good?
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I think that Blackest night (the main series and the tie-in miniseries) are solid, but if you have a fondness for the DC universe ... IT'S GREAT!
I really appreciate that the foundation for this story was slowly laid over the entire length of this current Green Lantern series. It really brewed my excitement for the whole "Blackest Night" into a fervor. That being said, I absolutely do not feel it's necessary for you to have read the whole run to enjoy "Blackest Night".
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I really appreciate that the foundation for this story was slowly laid over the entire length of this current Green Lantern series. It really brewed my excitement for the whole "Blackest Night" into a fervor. That being said, I absolutely do not feel it's necessary for you to have read the whole run to enjoy "Blackest Night".
That's what I was wondering about ... like with Batman or one of the other guys, they're icons and you can sort of jump in wherever ... there's lots of different timelines but you can still appreciate that you might be reading one author/artist's take on Batman if you know what I mean. Everyone gets what Batman is so you can go where ever you want in the mythology.
This Blackest Night stuff, and the Green Lantern series that came before it makes me wonder if anyone would be put off by it because the investment level or the "buy in" is bigger.
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I really appreciate that the foundation for this story was slowly laid over the entire length of this current Green Lantern series. It really brewed my excitement for the whole "Blackest Night" into a fervor. That being said, I absolutely do not feel it's necessary for you to have read the whole run to enjoy "Blackest Night".
That's what I was wondering about ... like with Batman or one of the other guys, they're icons and you can sort of jump in wherever ... there's lots of different timelines but you can still appreciate that you might be reading one author/artist's take on Batman if you know what I mean. Everyone gets what Batman is so you can go where ever you want in the mythology.
This Blackest Night stuff, and the Green Lantern series that came before it makes me wonder if anyone would be put off by it because the investment level or the "buy in" is bigger.
I think Blackest Night is more-or-less newbie friendly, but it is definitely worth going back and reading how Johns has been building up to this. "Rebirth," "Secret Origin," and "Sinestro Corps War" are all really fun, high-stakes sci-fi stories that are worth the money and make Blackest Night all the more enjoyable.
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I definitely think that I liked Sinestro Corp. War a lot better than Blackest Night. I find Blackest night to almost be too big and having 7 corps (well, now 9) is a bit hokey. I don't know. I find myself not enjoying Green Lantern nearly as much as I was before the Secret Origin storyline.
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Has anyone read Nemesis? That book is pretty intriguing. I think they might be setting that character up to be a future Kick Ass villain.
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I guess this is old news, but:
"Captain America: Reborn #1 revealed that Steve Rogers did not die; the gun used on him instead transported him to a fixed position in space and time."
...what?
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The Yankees are Superman, the Red Sox are Captain Marvel.
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The Yankees are Superman, the Red Sox are Captain Marvel.
The Billy Batson DC Captain Marvel I assume. Does anyone else watch Batman the Brave and the Bold? The last one I saw where he teamed up with Captain Marvel against Black Adam made me sad. Never really followed DC Captain Marvel, never even was interested in him until Kingdom Come (which I got only in the past few years). I remember Black Adam more, from Villains United. Which I think was awesome.
It's a really fun cartoon though. The Spectacular Spider-Man is really good too, I hope they make more of them. It's definitely a mix of main incarnation Spider-Man and Ultimate Spider-Man, but very enjoyable.
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Does anyone else watch Batman the Brave and the Bold?
Yes. I love this show. If superhero comics were this much fun, I would still buy them.
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Flipping through channels and seeing a cartoon Batman and Sherlock Holmes teaming up...just too cool for words.
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I definitely think that I liked Sinestro Corp. War a lot better than Blackest Night. I find Blackest night to almost be too big and having 7 corps (well, now 9) is a bit hokey. I don't know. I find myself not enjoying Green Lantern nearly as much as I was before the Secret Origin storyline.
Yeah, it's funny, but when I finished Blackest Night #8, I put the issue down and thought, "Wow, that was pretty dumb." Sinestro Corps War managed to be epic and have a real feeling of impending doom. Blackest Night just seemed crammed with tons of characters and real simple ruminations on death, with the stakes never seeming that high or the action that fun. It was also the first time I had the feeling that Johns was making stuff up as he went along. And I know I just said in a previous post that I'd recommend it, but it's probably best to stop with Sinestro Corps War.
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I just don't get almost all of the GL/Flash stuff. There are moments I really enjoy (i.e. the rogues), but for the most part it's just not my thing.
I was ready to give up on Blackest Night by issue 3. That said, I really don't know how I feel about Deadman being alive. He's always been one of my favorite DC guys, and it's weird seeing him...all there. Is he just like a normal guy now?
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Yes, I think Deadman is just a normal dude (for now). Blackest Night really went out with a whimper. At least I have the collectible power rings to show for it.
If Maxwell Lord is back, is Ted Kord? If it was mentioned in the series or a spin off I missed it.
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Did anyone else pick up the Patton Oswalt penned Serenity one-off? It's not bad!
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
Yeah. I liked it too. Clowes has got that understated mastery thing going these days.
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
Need to check this out. Is Clowes pretty much scrapping Eightball issues for full graphics now?
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Did anyone else pick up the Patton Oswalt penned Serenity one-off? It's not bad!
I purchased it ONLY because Patton wrote it. But I have absolutely no knowledge of the show Serenity. From what I understand the book is a memoriam for a character.
I'm gonna get more familiar with the show and then read the book later.
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How have I just now found this thread? I can talk about comics all day.
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
Need to check this out. Is Clowes pretty much scrapping Eightball issues for full graphics now?
I read an interview recently where he said that magazine-style comics are a relic of a bygone age. I think Eightball's done.
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Does anyone here like Transmetropolitan? I'm reading the first book and it seems to be written by a 15 year old boy who thinks "Fuck tha System" is deep philosophy.
Does the plot pick up? Is it worth pursuing?
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When I read a bunch of Transmetropolitan a few years ago, I thought it was a fun read - though I read it for free, via the library. I wouldn't have paid for it.
Like most of that Vertigo stuff, it's pretty adolescent. But I found the central premise - Hunter S. Thompson in a cyberpunk future - pretty amusing. I have no specific recollections of it improving greatly from the first few issues, though.
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When I read a bunch of Transmetropolitan a few years ago, I thought it was a fun read - though I read it for free, via the library. I wouldn't have paid for it.
Like most of that Vertigo stuff, it's pretty adolescent. But I found the central premise - Hunter S. Thompson in a cyberpunk future - pretty amusing. I have no specific recollections of it improving greatly from the first few issues, though.
Cool - I may bail after this first book ... I've got a huge back log of comics to catch up on & I don't want to waste my time on it ...
Thoughts/opinions on Heavy Liquid? Jonah Hex? Hellblazer? Where should I go next?
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I remember the first run of Hellblazer (the Jamie Delano stuff I think?) as being really good. The proviso being that I read it when it was initially published, so I was about 15 at the time. But it has a noir-ish dead end vibe that I liked a lot. I haven't revisited it, but in my mind at least, it's aged better than, say, Gaiman's Sandman.
Are you looking at classic Jonah Hex? Or is there some newer iteration of it?
I've just been re-reading my goofy Keith Giffen era Justice League from the late 80s. It made me realize that the 80s were a lot closer, culturally-speaking to the 50s/60s than they are to today. I mean, they were still publishing all those teeny ads for mail-order X-Ray specs, Sea Monkeys, and the Charles Atlas method.
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RE Jonah Hex - I have a book called No Way Back here ... no indication as to what vintage the comics gathered inside are.
RE Hellblazer - I'll go find the earlier stuff and see if I like that ... I think the current comics hitting now are Hellblazer India ... I have a huge pile here of comics on my desk and i think there are at least a couple of that.
RE Sandman - I am not at all sure I would like the story so I have avoided it, but they're reissuing the whole dang thing, so I may at least try vol 1.
RE - '80s culturally closer to '50s-'60s ... shit yes. The last time I read comics regularly (as a kid) those ads were commonplace.
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It looks like No Way Back is a brand new book, published in 2009 or 2010. Seems like DC is pushing its Silver Age properties these days.
A lot of people really like Sandman - notably women. I once overheard a (male) employee at a comic book shop reminiscing fondly about the glory days of Sandman, and how the store always had tons of chicks in those days. I've soured on it for some reason. It's a little too precious for me. But if you're a mythology/fantasy nerd, you might like it.
I should probably stop behaving as though I have any kind of authority on the subject. I haven't followed superhero/mainstream comic books for well over a decade.
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New Tales Designed to Thrizzle is out tomorrow - (june 9th). The guy at my local comic book store called me and reserved a copy for me, as not a lot were ordered - it might be similar in many stores, so fans might want to get to their stores when they can, or call ahead.
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Three different grandmothers gave Neil Gaiman's "The Wolves in the Walls" a one-star review (http://amzn.to/dkQbYy) because it wasn't appropriate for their grandchildren >:(
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Oh man. I guess I don't read a lot of the one-star reviews in general, but here are some more gems (http://www.amazon.com/Day-Swapped-Dad-Two-Goldfish/product-reviews/0060587032/ref=cm_cr_dp_hist_1?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&filterBy=addOneStar). Do people really not know how a ratings system is used?
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Three different grandmothers gave Neil Gaiman's "The Wolves in the Walls" a one-star review (http://amzn.to/dkQbYy) because it wasn't appropriate for their grandchildren >:(
Here's my favorite quote
"First, I couldn't get past the strong smell of the ink used! It's overpowering!! "
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Three different grandmothers gave Neil Gaiman's "The Wolves in the Walls" a one-star review (http://amzn.to/dkQbYy) because it wasn't appropriate for their grandchildren >:(
As hilarious as those are, reviews like that piss me off. I know anyone worth their salt will ignore them but still. COMPUTER PRIVILEGES REVOKED!
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Is anyone reading Daytripper? Because that's some pretty weird and wild stuff right there. Totally worth reading. And S.H.I.E.L.D. so far has been excellent.
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S.H.I.E.L.D. so far has been excellent.
S.H.I.E.L.D. is the best mainstream book right now. (humble opinion)
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The topic I always love to poke when I am away from the board for an extended period!
Picked up the Tales Designed to Thrizzle hardcover and am LOVING it.
S.H.I.E.L.D. is a book i legitimately cannot believe is being released because it is such high concept ideas and I'm sure it sells like crap but it is AWESOME.
And picked up Absolute Planetary and am looking forward to finally reading through it all!
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Picked up the Tales Designed to Thrizzle hardcover and am LOVING it.
I saved this for some serious hammock time during vacation which I have just returned from. It was wonderful.
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
Yeah. I liked it too. Clowes has got that understated mastery thing going these days.
I enjoyed it though part of me still misses the old funny comics he used to dop in the early issues of EIGHTBALL. He's obviously brilliant at what he does, but he's kind of like Bill Murray and Steve Martin in that I wish he could find the time to fit in some of the silliness he used to do.
Also- The recent INVINCIBLE IRON MAN ANNUAL written by FOT Matt Fraction was great as was the reprint of CASSANOVA #1 that Marvel just put out that I had never read before. And anything written by the late, great Harvey Pekar is well worth reading.
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S.H.I.E.L.D. so far has been excellent.
S.H.I.E.L.D. is the best mainstream book right now. (humble opinion)
Amen. Hickman is one of my favorite writers right now. His run on Fantastic Four has been solid. Reminds me of why I liked the book so much when I was a kid.
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Finally picked up I Kill Giants the other day and was gobsmacked by how amazing it was. I was on the verge of tears towards the end.
I'm still loving the 28 Days Later book, despite usually hating property books like this.
On the same note, I just bought a few issues of GI Joe: Hearts and Minds because it was written by World War Z's Max Brooks. It's interesting, but basically a set of one off -or two off- character studies per issue.
I keep meaning to read the new Dark Tower series, because Sean Phillips is on art, but I just can't bring myself to devote more time to that. I like the comics more than anything after book 4, but it's just kind of a book I want closed at this point.
Oh, and Paul Cornell's new book about Lex Luthor has been pretty great and somewhat creepy at the same time.
S.H.I.E.L.D. so far has been excellent.
S.H.I.E.L.D. is the best mainstream book right now. (humble opinion)
I really like it, but it's SO WORDY. I'd rather just read a book.
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Finally picked up I Kill Giants the other day and was gobsmacked by how amazing it was. I was on the verge of tears towards the end.
On the same note, I just bought a few issues of GI Joe: Hearts and Minds because it was written by World War Z's Max Brooks. It's interesting, but basically a set of one off -or two off- character studies per issue.
That's funny because I brought I KILL GIANTS with me to work today to read during my lunch hour. I had 2 chapters/issues to go and found it impossible not to get misty eyed and damn hard to keep from bawling. I wasn't sure how it was going to end, but it took a turn I didn't see coming (even though I should have) and... it's just great. One of those comics I'd suggest to anyone who thinks they don't like comics.
I also like GI JOE: HEARTS AND MINDS even though I find it pretty skippable in that literally nothing happens. The cream of the GI JOE comics crop right now is GI JOE: COBRA. Now that's a good read.
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Is anyone else reading the Superman 'Grounded' storyline? For me it alternates between "great" and "kinda silly". But I do love the idea of it, so I'm sticking with it to see where it goes.
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I read Daniel Clowes' Wilson last week. Enjoyed it a lot.
Yeah. I liked it too. Clowes has got that understated mastery thing going these days.
I enjoyed it though part of me still misses the old funny comics he used to dop in the early issues of EIGHTBALL. He's obviously brilliant at what he does, but he's kind of like Bill Murray and Steve Martin in that I wish he could find the time to fit in some of the silliness he used to do.
Also- The recent INVINCIBLE IRON MAN ANNUAL written by FOT Matt Fraction was great as was the reprint of CASSANOVA #1 that Marvel just put out that I had never read before. And anything written by the late, great Harvey Pekar is well worth reading.
I finally got a chance to read Wilson this week (praise to the institution that is our local library). I did like how he managed to make each page a 'gag' strip that could stand on its own, in the context of the bigger story. Also enjoyed the variation in drawing style from page to page. I never really got a chance to read his old EIGHTBALL stuff, so I should track it down.
I also read Kevin Huizenga's Curses. 'Jeepers Jacobs', with the theology professor pondering whether his new golfing buddy who's a non-believer is in for 'Eternal, Conscious Torment (ECT)' or just anihilation when he dies was especially memorable.
Finally I am reading Vol I of the Cartoon History Of The Universe, obtained at a library book sale for $1.50.
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Is anyone else reading the Superman 'Grounded' storyline? For me it alternates between "great" and "kinda silly". But I do love the idea of it, so I'm sticking with it to see where it goes.
I got as far as the first panel (http://twitpic.com/25fhpg), which is just about least-informed representaiton of Philadelphia I've ever seen.
Also, JMS just kinda bugs me.
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I'm not a JMS fan at all, but to be fair, the next panel reveals that all those guys are standing in front of the King of Jeans.
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Really appreciate the recommendation of Asterios Polyp. Really wonderful and sad. (But not sad in the way that almost didn't let me finish Jimmy Corrigan.)
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I'm on the hunt for Asterios Polyp myself. I'm a big fan of Mazzucheli and personally think he draws Frank Miller Stories better than Frank MIller.
Also, I read I Kill Giants on multiple recommendations (this thread being one of them) and really enjoyed it. I handed it to my girlfriend as soon as I finished it.
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That reminds me - JonfromMaplewood and I talked about having a big NYC/Jersey meetup where we bring a stack of good comics and trade with other people for a few months, then trade back, trade again, etc. Would anyone want to do it? Would be a fun way to get exposed to new books.
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That reminds me - JonfromMaplewood and I talked about having a big NYC/Jersey meetup where we bring a stack of good comics and trade with other people for a few months, then trade back, trade again, etc. Would anyone want to do it? Would be a fun way to get exposed to new books.
I'm in. You guys can have all the DC crap you want.
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I might even make the trip for that: I love DC crap!
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Really appreciate the recommendation of Asterios Polyp. Really wonderful and sad. (But not sad in the way that almost didn't let me finish Jimmy Corrigan.)
I'm always so happy to hear regular comic readers praise Asterios Polyp. There was a 'Roundtable Discussion" of it over at tcj.com where the 'comic critics' ripped it for days. There was some slight praise every few pages but they were relentless. And here I thought it was helping to push comics up and out in the realm of 'legit reading', apparently they disagree.
I just wrapped Woodring's Weathercraft for a 3rd time - I still feel like there is more absorbing to be done.
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Anyone read Bodyworld yet? I've got a copy of this b/c the book nerd in me couldn't pass up unusual book design. Haven't started it yet though.
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I'm halfway through Blankets. It reads like an indie Dawson's Crick drawn in the style of For Better or For Worse. The writing is getting pretty pretentious and it's my 4th graphic novel in a row where the main character has been an awkward weenie. But it's the highest rated comic on my whole Amazon list. Should I continue to the end?
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I thought Blankets was awful, too. As I recall, I read the whole thing, but it didn't get any better. Maybe I was just too old for it? I think if I had been a 15-year-old, it might have resonated, but even then I may have been too sour for it.
I haven't read Bodyworlds, but I did read Bottomless Belly Button, the guy's first big book. I mentally filed it under "shows promise". I'm looking forward to having a chance to get to Bodyworlds.
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I thought Bottomless Belly Button and Blankets were written by two different guys.
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Oh yeah - they were. I was just being unclear. Blankets was by someone (Craig? David?) Thompson, and BBB and Bodyworlds are by Dash Shaw.
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Oh heck, I accidentally started a new thread for this question. COPY / PASTE:
Are there any of these that are even a little bit okay places for a grown person interested in the craft and creators?
Like, barring a better example, what is the AST of Comic Books?
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tjc.com's message board. For an even more scholastic read head over to the http://hoodedutilitarian.blogspot.com/ (http://hoodedutilitarian.blogspot.com/) - mental masturbation for the academic CB reader.
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Awwwesome. I totally forgot about TCJ. I can feel the graphite under my fingernails already.
What about for poppy-er stuff? Make Mine Marvel, etc.
Also, podcasts? I really don't want to have to make one myself.
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I'm halfway through Blankets. It reads like an indie Dawson's Crick drawn in the style of For Better or For Worse. The writing is getting pretty pretentious and it's my 4th graphic novel in a row where the main character has been an awkward weenie. But it's the highest rated comic on my whole Amazon list. Should I continue to the end?
The modern indy style is not without its own stereotypes. The "awkward weenie" is one of them.
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Awwwesome. I totally forgot about TCJ. I can feel the graphite under my fingernails already.
What about for poppy-er stuff? Make Mine Marvel, etc.
Also, podcasts? I really don't want to have to make one myself.
For comics podcasts I like- http://warrocketajax.com/ (http://warrocketajax.com/) (which is actually the first place I ever heard about The Best Show for whatever that's worth. They get off topic sometimes but... I say listen to the most recent episode featuring Nate Cosby because it's pretty represetative of their typical episode. If you like it listen to more. If not then don't.
http://awesomedbycomics.blogspot.com/ (http://awesomedbycomics.blogspot.com/) The hosts (a husband and wife which makes for some good chemistry) basically discuss the comic that came out that week that they enjoyed.
There are others, but those are my 2 favorites.
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(http://www.raintaxi.com/online/2000winter/images/cerebus.jpg)
the last comic I'll ever love.
I'm about 2/3 of the way through Sim/ Gerhard's opus. I'm not sure how enjoyable I'd say it is but its achievement cannot be denied.
I've been giving his current work "Glamourpuss" a shot, but so far it seems too unfocused, almost like it's more Sim's sketch tracing book than anything. At least that's how it seems from the first few issues.
I'm considering reading "Bone" or going back through my old issues of "Tales from the Beanworld"...
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I'm halfway through Blankets. It reads like an indie Dawson's Crick drawn in the style of For Better or For Worse. The writing is getting pretty pretentious and it's my 4th graphic novel in a row where the main character has been an awkward weenie. But it's the highest rated comic on my whole Amazon list. Should I continue to the end?
The modern indy style is not without its own stereotypes. The "awkward weenie" is one of them.
I'm definitely learning that. I'm also 35 and maybe not the intended audience. It's also supply and demand. Some people love melancholy comics with self-pitying characters like they love melancholy music with a self-pitying singer (guilty). I was just surprised after being out of comics for 20 years that when I picked up a bunch of recent books from the indy comics canon, literally every lead character was a sad bastard with female troubles. That seems like an archetype (like the all-American superhero) that would get old after awhile.
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I was just surprised after being out of comics for 20 years that when I picked up a bunch of recent books from the indy comics canon, literally every lead character was a sad bastard with female troubles.
That is to say they're all like Buddy Bradley?
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Just started reading Planetary. Loving it to death. I got the two Absolute Editions because I am a HUGE fan of Cassaday's work. I cannot believe people had to wait like, 11 years for this to finish. i would never have been able to make sense of it with months or a year between issues. But as a whole? Wonderful. about 10 more issues to go.
I've wanted to do a comic podcast for a long time just never knew anybody else that really followed comics. If there's one thing I can talk about on end it's comics (and tv...).
I'm getting to the point where I haven't bought comics in 3 months and I really don't miss the singles that much. Is this what growing up feels like?
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Finished Planetary. Loved it.
Just finished the first five issue arc of Black Widow by Marjorie Liu and Daniel Acuna and it ruled. Very good espionage comic and while I usually dislike Acuna's art, it fit the story perfectly and he really knocked it out of the park.
About to go back and read a lof of the Lee/Kirby Fantastic Four run. Excited!
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Has anyone else read Jeff Lemire's Superboy? I'm really excited for how this might turn out.
Oh, and Criminal is back!
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In the last couple of months I went from spending upwards of $100 a month on individual comics to getting everything from the library. There are a few things I'll probably have to buy as trade paperbacks because the library doesn't have everything, but it'll be a while before I run out of comics. I've even reread a few things I bought individually (specifically Grant Morrison's Final Crisis and Batman & Robin to see if they were any easier to follow. They weren't really). My local branch also has most of the Walking Dead series so I might check that out.
I miss my Wednesday ritual a little, but I really don't miss spending all that money and having to figure out what to do with hundreds of magazines I'll probably never read again.
Other comics read this way, with capsule reviews:
-Dan Clowes' Wilson, which was okay, but it feels like he's phoning it in a little.
-Brian Michael Bendis' House of M, which was also okay, but it has that problem of Bendis' where it feels like you're reading the minutes from a bunch of endless superhero meetings.
-A couple of editions from Carla Speed McNeil's Finder series, which is really good, kind of a cross between Love & Rockets and Fables, and is actually pretty hard to find.
-FOT Matt Fraction's Dark Avengers/X-Men: Utopia. Good stuff!
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I just read 'Logicomix', which is about Bertrand Russell, Wittgenstein, Von Neumann, Gödel, that whole gang. I very much liked it as a fan of Bertrand Russell. It acknowledges the 'mathematicians are all insane' stereotype, but doesn't wallow in it (still - many of the major characters: insane). Mostly it's a pretty straight re-telling of the story, with some discussion from the authors/artists along the way.
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'mathematicians are all insane'
I telling Crazy Dave about this.
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This fall I starting reading Geoff Johns' Green Lantern run. Started with Rebirth and just now getting into Blackest Night. It's much better than I had imagined it being. This is a very focused series and, other than a few digressions, it stays on the single driving story all the way through. Pretty good read.
I'm usually a Marvel or indie guy, but catching up on the DC stuff has been fun. I read a bunch of Grant Morrison's Batman this summer as well as Final Crisis. Weird and not all good, but still fun.
Has anyone read Promethea by Alan Moore and JH Williams III? I'm a big fan of Williams artwork, but I don't have many books he's done other than some Batman, Batwoman, and Desolation Jones.
Thanks for the great thread!
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I read a bunch of Promethea, and I didn't love it, despite generally being a fan of Alan Moore. It reminded me a lot of Sandman in that it serves as a survey of mythology and half-baked philosophy. If you're the kind of person who likes to use the word "magick" it will be right up your alley.
Alan Moore has earned the right to do whatever he wants, but as far as his work from that era, I prefer Tom Tomorrow, and the pulpier, more fun stories.
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I read a bunch of Promethea, and I didn't love it, despite generally being a fan of Alan Moore. It reminded me a lot of Sandman in that it serves as a survey of mythology and half-baked philosophy. If you're the kind of person who likes to use the word "magick" it will be right up your alley.
Alan Moore has earned the right to do whatever he wants, but as far as his work from that era, I prefer Tom Tomorrow, and the pulpier, more fun stories.
I found Promethea got better and better as it went along. I think it's definitely seeing through til the end.
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Thoughts on this?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4b/Neil_Young%27s_Greendale_%282010%29_GN_cover.jpg)
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Thoughts on this?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4b/Neil_Young%27s_Greendale_%282010%29_GN_cover.jpg)
I thought it was the last good album he made.
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Anyone reading Sweet Tooth (http://www.amazon.com/Sweet-Tooth-Vol-Out-Woods/dp/1401226965/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1298037533&sr=8-1)? My interest in comic books has waned in the last couple years, but this is the best thing I've read in a long time.
It's--dare I say it--Coen Brothers-esque.
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I apologise if I'm re-treading old ground (I didn' read thru all 32 pages)
I'm a fan of The Goon (not sure if its still going?)
and I've been into Walking Dead since the start but I'm kinda bummed out on it recently. I feel like maybe it should just end soon. The most recent stuff seems kinda, not unoriginal but just not fresh like it was earlier. Perhaps his focus was on the TV show (which i thought was good but I didn't get why it was so different to the comic. Book 1-3 are solid gold, why fuck with that?)
and DMZ is cool stuff
and Y the Last Man
and whilst not technically a "comic" the Twisted Toyfare Theatre collections are amazing
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Currently reading the Walter Simonson run on Thor via the new Omnibus. So far I'm LOVING IT and the recolored pages are great looking. Never used to really enjoy Simonson's art but this stuff just leaps off the pages.
Plus Thor was never a favorite but this stuff is just really fun. Getting me pumped and primed for the movie next week.
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For all the Harvey Pekar fans here, have you seen this?
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1844705603/harvey-pekar-library-statue-comics-as-art-and-lite (http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1844705603/harvey-pekar-library-statue-comics-as-art-and-lite)
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I'm slowly working my way through the first volume of Fantagraphics' re-issuing of Walt Kelly's old stip "Pogo". I pre-order the book three years ago and kept getting e-mail upon e-mail regarding delays, but the wait was worth it. The book is gorgeous. Walt Kelly was such a great artist. Truly a master of the form...
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I haven't read much Thor, but that Omnibus looks awesome and I want.
The newly revamped Action Comics is great. Easily the best of the new DC relaunch.
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I haven't read much Thor, but that Omnibus looks awesome and I want.
The newly revamped Action Comics is great. Easily the best of the new DC relaunch.
I'm really enjoying Jeff Lemire's Animal Man, Scott Snyder's Batman, Demon Knights is fun, and All-Star Western is pretty decent.
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I haven't read much Thor, but that Omnibus looks awesome and I want.
The newly revamped Action Comics is great. Easily the best of the new DC relaunch.
I'm really enjoying Jeff Lemire's Animal Man, Scott Snyder's Batman, Demon Knights is fun, and All-Star Western is pretty decent.
Agree with all of these. I'm also enjoying THE FLASH even though I admit it's pretty art with a pretty pedestrian story. I've also been enjoying SERGIO ARAGONE'S FUNNIES. That guy is a master and judging by his autobio stories he's led an interesting life as well.
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This week saw the beginning of Paul Grist's Mud Man, from Image.
New Paul Grist is always a treat, check it out!
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Yeah, enjoying Animal Man too. Among others. The art in Batwoman is f'ing beautiful but the story is rubbish so I couldn't hang with it. A shame. Hopefully it will get a proper writer.
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Scott Snyder's been killing it lately. I've been enjoying the DC stuff a lot more than Marvel as of late, so I guess the relaunch worked...
I've never been a huge Fraction fan, but his stuff since he's stopped calling into the show (Fear Itself, Invincible Iron Man, Thor) has just taken a nosedive for me. It might be that the event wasn't my thing and I just don't really love either of those characters, but I was really enjoying the Iron Man book up until a few issues ago.
I don't know if anyone else here is a Rucka fan (he's probably my favorite comic writer), but he's got a free online comic with Rich Burchett (who drew a great Queen & Country story) that I've been enjoying quite a bit in spite of my general aversion to steampunk. It's updated twice a week here:
http://www.ineffableaether.com/archive/ (http://www.ineffableaether.com/archive/)
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I'm just getting back into reading comic books again, but some of the things I enjoyed or am currently enjoying are Bone, Hellboy, Nemesis the Warlock, Batman (various), Pluto (Urasawa x Tezuka), Monster, and Jimmy Corrigan, the Smartest Kid on Earth.
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so I guess Marvel's 2012 event will be the Avengers vs. X-Men, written by Bendis, Fraction, Brubaker, Aaron & Hickman and drawn by John Romita Jr., Olivier Coipel, and Adam Kubert (http://io9.com/5865591/marvel-comics-spills-the-beans-on-their-big-2012-event-avengers-vs-x+men).
sure? I don't enjoy JRJR's art as much as everyone else seems to, but this could be interesting. It's be curious to see how they split up the writing duties...
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I'm not a rabid comic book guy but I collect a few titles, it's way too hard to keep up with everything coming out of the USA so I listen to Comic Book Vine podcast which occasionally gives me a tip on a new title. I've also been doing comic book submissions lately, I write and a freelance artist arts, I'm hoping I can get one picked up otherwise I guess I'll self publish eventually as I don't want my stories to die on my hard drive.
My tips: 'Miracleman' it's way out there compared too your regular superhero stuff but it's good. 'X-Men' when it's the good writer years like Matt Fraction.
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CRIMINAL: LAST OF THE INNOCENT (http://www.cheapgraphicnovels.com/product.php?productid=33734&cat=0&page=1) comes out in trade paperback today. This was great arc. Intro by Patton Oswalt. (Link goes to a site for 45% off if you don't have a LCBS.)
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The new Action Comics is indeed pretty awesome.
I can't decide how I feel about Superman in a t-shirt and cape, though. It's either really silly or kind of awesome. Maybe both.
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I don't know if there are any horror comics fans here, but if you're not reading this tandem of Animal Man and Swamp Thing, you're totally missing out.
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I don't know if there are any horror comics fans here, but if you're not reading this tandem of Animal Man and Swamp Thing, you're totally missing out.
A couple of people, including me, have mentioned them above. I agree, Animal Man is fantastic. When I found out about the upcoming cross over, I feel the need to get the back Swamp Thing issues.
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I was a little hesitant on both, since I've never read any Animal Man (though I'm aware I should've checked out the Grant Morrison run by now. I'm still working my way through his Doom Patrol), and I've only read the Alan Moore run and one Len Wein trade of Swamp Thing.
I think the new run of Animal Man started out stronger, but whoo boy Swamp Thing is about to get messy. I was concerned about the fill-in artists because Yannick Paquette is one of my favorite artists, but they've totally kept up the tone of the book without being a poor facsimile of his art. It doesn't hurt that Snyder has a scary brain...
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Animal Man's a hoot (though you often notice the shorter page count), but Swamp Thing ain't doin' it fer me. Paquette's an incredible artist, and those neck snappy folk in the first issue were some primo horror, but there's not a lot else there - it feels very slight. The heavy reliance on Alan Moore's run, while inevitable, just makes me feel like it'd be a better use of my time/money to read that (only read the first few collections).
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Animal Man's a hoot (though you often notice the shorter page count), but Swamp Thing ain't doin' it fer me. Paquette's an incredible artist, and those neck snappy folk in the first issue were some primo horror, but there's not a lot else there - it feels very slight. The heavy reliance on Alan Moore's run, while inevitable, just makes me feel like it'd be a better use of my time/money to read that (only read the first few collections).
You know what? I always felt like the issues of Animal Man felt rushed but it never dawned on me that the actual page count was lower. Why would they do that?
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CRIMINAL: LAST OF THE INNOCENT (http://www.cheapgraphicnovels.com/product.php?productid=33734&cat=0&page=1) comes out in trade paperback today. This was great arc. Intro by Patton Oswalt. (Link goes to a site for 45% off if you don't have a LCBS.)
Just finished this. My favorite Criminal arc by far. Patton's intro was a little lacking though, I thought, to be honest.
I like how Brubaker is developing the backstory of the city more with appearances by Hyde and Teeg Lawless.
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Making this a zombie thread after the brief comic book discussion during tonight's show [on-air and in the chat room].
Tom said that Ed Brubaker's Captain America and Matt Fraction's Iron Man are the best superhero books right now. I would add Mark Waid's Daredevil to the list. Brubaker also has a non-superhero title - Fatale - that is my fave current comic.
What inspires you to purchase a particular comic: a certain character; you like the writer; the art is quality stuff?
I've been a comic book fan pretty much my entire life. I've worked at comic book shops in Dallas and Seattle. Right now I'm really getting into comics again. The whole DC Universe relaunch piqued my attention and got me in a local comic shop. Once there I was dismayed by what's passing for comic art these days. I'm not terribly familiar with some of the writers so I started with titles featuring what are probably my three favorite superheroes: Captain America; Daredevil; and Detective Comics. I've been picking up Action Comics and Suicide Squad based on a friend's recommendation. I've been picking up a few other titles as well. It's all been very hit and miss.
I have an affinity for Alex Ross and Adam Hughes covers so I'll buy any book that has one. Ross has been doing covers for The Bionic Man which features a beloved character [Steve Austin] from my childhood. Kevin Smith [yes, THAT Kevin Smith] is the writer so I wasn't entirely motivated to actually read the damned thing. Eventually I did and I have to say...I went in with EXTREMELY low expectations and Kevin managed to somehow churn out something worse than I'd expected. Seriously, I can't recall ever reading a comic as poorly written as The Bionic Man. Absofuckinglutely amazing.
So what have you been reading? What's worth buying?
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They priced me out of fandom when the books went from 10 to 12 cents.
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Making this a zombie thread after the brief comic book discussion during tonight's show [on-air and in the chat room].
Tom said that Ed Brubaker's Captain America and Matt Fraction's Iron Man are the best superhero books right now. I would add Mark Waid's Daredevil to the list. Brubaker also has a non-superhero title - Fatale - that is my fave current comic.
What inspires you to purchase a particular comic: a certain character; you like the writer; the art is quality stuff?
I've been a comic book fan pretty much my entire life. I've worked at comic book shops in Dallas and Seattle. Right now I'm really getting into comics again. The whole DC Universe relaunch piqued my attention and got me in a local comic shop. Once there I was dismayed by what's passing for comic art these days. I'm not terribly familiar with some of the writers so I started with titles featuring what are probably my three favorite superheroes: Captain America; Daredevil; and Detective Comics. I've been picking up Action Comics and Suicide Squad based on a friend's recommendation. I've been picking up a few other titles as well. It's all been very hit and miss.
I have an affinity for Alex Ross and Adam Hughes covers so I'll buy any book that has one. Ross has been doing covers for The Bionic Man which features a beloved character [Steve Austin] from my childhood. Kevin Smith [yes, THAT Kevin Smith] is the writer so I wasn't entirely motivated to actually read the damned thing. Eventually I did and I have to say...I went in with EXTREMELY low expectations and Kevin managed to somehow churn out something worse than I'd expected. Seriously, I can't recall ever reading a comic as poorly written as The Bionic Man. Absofuckinglutely amazing.
So what have you been reading? What's worth buying?
I haven't picked it up because it got a ton of negative reviews but I heard Detective Comics was bad. On the other hand, Batman, by Scott Snyder, is absolutely amazing. This whole Court of the Owls story line is really fun. I'll admit that I'm disappointed that they're going to do a big crossover in all the Batman books for this story line. That's the kind of thing that keeps me being an on and off again comic book reader.
I've gotten behind on the trade paperbacks but Scalped is a really awesome crime comic. It's a noir-ish Western set on an Indian reservation. Like a lot of crime comics, sometimes it's attempts to seem gritty get overplayed. But on the whole, a great read.
I'm a dummy so I didn't preorder it but Saga is supposed to be really good. Brian K. Vaughan's return to comics. I've added it to my pull list so I'm hoping to catch up.
Wonder Woman by Brian Azzarello is a great read. He's completely redefining the mythos around the character by incorporating all the Greek Gods but doing it in a really smart and fun way.
Swamp Thing/Animal Man are really great as well.
Here is my pull list: Batman, Wonder Woman, Swamp Thing, Animal Man, Saga
Here are the titles I've dropped since getting back into weekly comics buying: Demon Knights, All Star Western
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The Punisher's actually pretty good right now. Just the normal Punisher, not Punisher Max (that's drawn by Steve Dillon so don't bother unless you like every single character having exactly the same face, and only drawn from straight ahead or at 90 degrees)
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I haven't picked it up because it got a ton of negative reviews but I heard Detective Comics was bad. On the other hand, Batman, by Scott Snyder, is absolutely amazing. This whole Court of the Owls story line is really fun. I'll admit that I'm disappointed that they're going to do a big crossover in all the Batman books for this story line. That's the kind of thing that keeps me being an on and off again comic book reader.
I've gotten behind on the trade paperbacks but Scalped is a really awesome crime comic. It's a noir-ish Western set on an Indian reservation. Like a lot of crime comics, sometimes it's attempts to seem gritty get overplayed. But on the whole, a great read.
I'm a dummy so I didn't preorder it but Saga is supposed to be really good. Brian K. Vaughan's return to comics. I've added it to my pull list so I'm hoping to catch up.
Wonder Woman by Brian Azzarello is a great read. He's completely redefining the mythos around the character by incorporating all the Greek Gods but doing it in a really smart and fun way.
Swamp Thing/Animal Man are really great as well.
Here is my pull list: Batman, Wonder Woman, Swamp Thing, Animal Man, Saga
Here are the titles I've dropped since getting back into weekly comics buying: Demon Knights, All Star Western
I'll give Batman a look. I went with Detective because I liked the art better. I'll take a look at the other titles you recommended as well. Thanks for the input.
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The Punisher's actually pretty good right now. Just the normal Punisher, not Punisher Max (that's drawn by Steve Dillon so don't bother unless you like every single character having exactly the same face, and only drawn from straight ahead or at 90 degrees)
I liked PUNISHER MAX. True, Dillon only draws one face, but it didn't bother me on PREACHER and (not to compare the two) it didn't bother me here.
PROPHET published my Image is really good and SAGA's first issue was also fantastic..
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My pull list is getting ridiculous (in no particular order):
Fatale - Brubaker and Phillips doing it again.
The Secret History of D.B. Cooper - Brian Churilla draws and writes. Only one issue so far but good.
Casanova - Weird, funny, excellent
Daredevil - Got a hole bunch of Eisner nods. Totally deserved them too.
Lone Ranger - The Francavilla covers alone are worth it but it is a great book overall.
Defenders - Fraction writing Dr. Strange? Yes, please.
Brilliant - Bendis. Interested to see where this is going.
Spaceman - Loving this.
Prophet - Loving this too.
Ultimate Comics Spider-Man
Saucer Country - Only one issue so far. Good start.
Saga - Only one issue. The writing is great as well as the art.
Manhattan Projects - Again, one issue so far.
Mudman
Peter Panzerfaust
Steed & Mrs. Peel
Thief of Thieves
Supercrooks
(These I get comped but would be pulling:)
Usagi Yojimbo
B.P.R.D.
Goon
Lobster Johnson
Hell Boy
*whew* I am sure I am forgetting a couple but, man, there really are some good comics out there right now.
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Fraction and Brubaker are super duper rad indeed.
Just for fun here's my comic book submissions so far with Bruce Lugli as the artist.
http://bodycountcomicbook.blogspot.com.au/ (http://bodycountcomicbook.blogspot.com.au/)
http://atmospherecomicbook.blogspot.com.au/ (http://atmospherecomicbook.blogspot.com.au/)
and illustrated blog novel in progress:
http://otherworldnovel.blogspot.com.au/ (http://otherworldnovel.blogspot.com.au/)
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I was spending $100 a month on comics I had no place to store and most of which I never wanted to read again, so I just decided to read trade paperbacks, usually borrowed from the library or bought used or remaindered, unless I wanted to support the artist. The only comic I buy new is Love & Rockets, which is a trade paperback anyway.
I just finished the Ann Nocenti/John Romita Jr. Daredevil trade, Lone Stranger, which is of its time but pretty great. Also recently read the Bendis/Romita Avengers saga where they fight Kang, which was startlingly bad -- for somebody who has written some of the best comics of the last decade, he's written some truly dreadful Avengers stories. I really enjoyed some John Byrne/George Perez Avengers collections from the early 80s, which was totally chasing after what I liked as a 10-year-old but still a lot of fun.
I'm currently reading a couple of DC hardcover editions of Jack Cole's Plastic Man. Also been enjoying Finder, Walking Dead, Queen & Country, Various Jason collections from Fantagraphics, Grant Morrison's Batman & Robin, Fraction's Iron Man, and Brubaker's Captain America. I've read most of what Dan Clowes has put out lately, but man has he gotten boring. I really miss the old creepy/satiric/surreal days of Eightball.
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I don't know exactly what I am spending but I do get a substantial discount plus any Dark Horse comic I get comped (It's unfortunate that so many of their books stink right now, however I am looking forward to The Massive). I know if you preorder, you can save 30 - 35% at certain shops and online retailers. But, yes...space can be an issue. We have the room now so It's not to much of a big deal. YET. I am just hoping I can hold on to them long enough to get my son interested. I know that comics were my gateway drug into becoming a reader. Maybe they will work for him too.
I took a LONG break from comics except for stuff like Clowes, Ware and such but now working in the industry, I am reading a whole bunch again. Still can't get into DC & Marvel super heroes though. There are very few I have enjoyed or are enjoying. Fraction's Iron Man, and Brubaker's Captain America were very good though.
Right now, I am going back to read some things I missed like Y: The Last Man, DMZ, the first Criminal arcs. Finder is excellent as was Habibi and Green River Killer. Matt Kindt's 3 Story was super great. Very moving. He has something coming out with Dark Horse soon that I am looking forward to. I scored ten volumes of the Nexus archives brand new for 80% off. I really like them. Dated, but really fun mid 80's sci-fi.
I was working at ECCC last weekend. It was the first time I had ever been to a con. I was pretty much working the whole time but I did meet a whole bunch of creators after hours: Francisco Francavilla, Tony Moore, Greg Rucka, Daryl Gregory, Chris Roberson, Rich Ellis, Francis Manapul, Brian Buccellato. I ran in to Matt Fraction and his wife in the elevator and it took about 15 seconds before our conversation turned to Gary the Squirrel (which he said his daughter LOVES). Also met Mackro in Seattle who calls into the show. Super great guy. Bummed I couldn't hang out with him more.
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I took a LONG break from comics except for stuff like Clowes, Ware...
Chris Ware is amazing, and I used to just love "Eightball"...
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Big Plastic Head:
So you work for Dark Horse, then? What do you do, if you don't mind me asking? I'm very curious about the comics industry because I feel the comics industry press tends to not really focus on the business or behind the scenes stuff but the fanboy outrages and those other distractions.
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I work for Things From Another World (tfaw.com) which is part of DH. TFAW is where Mike Richardson started before publishing. There are three Portland locations and then one at Universal City Walk in LA, and the large on-line store. I am their graphic designer, working in the DH offices: Posters, flyers, web banners and such. I also am taking them through a full redesign of the web site which is long over due. I've been there since around August of last year. I really like it however the pay isn't that great. But I love the folks I work with and never dread going in to work. And it's about a mile and a half from my house.
I think there are plenty of comic sites that talk about the business, at least in my experience, especially now that digital is in it's infancy. Comics Alliance does a pretty good job and even posts monthly sales just to track the different publishers. CBR does some good reporting. In fact, I recommend their last interview with Mike Mignola where he talks about the problems of creators focusing too much on their marketing and not enough about the work itself. It was only a couple of weeks ago. Should be easy to find on their site.
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Close to twenty years ago there was a comic art show at a pop-up art gallery here in Dallas. The exhibit featured the work of Dan Piraro and Dan Clowes among others. They were both in attendance for the opening. At the time I was still employed by Lone Star Comics, whose owner - Buddy Saunders - was a lightning rod of controversy within the industry. Gary Groth of Fantagraphics was one of Saunders' most outspoken critics and seemed to relish taking him to task within the pages of The Comics Journal.
Clowes was virtually unknown at the time. Piraro was clearly the "star" of the show (he has ties to Dallas and his Bizarro work was popular in the local paper as a result). I ended up spending most of the opening at a table having drinks with Clowes who once he learned that I worked for Buddy Saunders had lots of questions to ask. I spent the next several months terrified that a.) something I said about Buddy would get back to him; and b.) that I would end up as a character - and a miserable, unfavorable character at that - within the pages of Eightball. As far as I know neither happened.
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On a whim I picked up a collection of "Darkest Night" at the library. I spent most of my adolescence steeped in DC mythology back in the late 80s/early 90s. And I continue to watch many of the animated DC films and tv shows. But holy cow, this thing is completely impenetrable. I feel the way I do when I've read manga: "I'll just assume this makes sense in Japan and go with the flow, because I can't make heads or tails of it."
The whole thing is just so baroque, complicated and downright silly... Nice art, though. Having read this thing, I can see why they would want to clean house with a venture like "the New 52." But I don't know why they care so much about continuity in the first place. I guess the fans like it, but goddammit, why can't they just tell stories, and not sweat the continuity! Readers will forgive just about everything if the stories are compelling.
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Just listening to the podcast for 25-Sep-12 and Tom's anti-pun stance - which I am usually sympathetic to - reminded me that King City (http://www.imagecomics.com/comics/4580/King-City-TP-MR-) is packed full of Puns Done Right, and very good in any case - comics people really should check it out.
Cartoonist Brandon Graham is also currently writing Prophet (http://www.imagecomics.com/comics/4954/Prophet-Vol-1-Remission), a revival of an old Rob Liefield (yep) comic in a weird-creepy-cool post-acopalyptic sci-fi series that stands alone and requires no prior knowledge of the character.
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Just listening to the podcast for 25-Sep-12 and Tom's anti-pun stance - which I am usually sympathetic to - reminded me that King City (http://www.imagecomics.com/comics/4580/King-City-TP-MR-) is packed full of Puns Done Right, and very good in any case - comics people really should check it out.
Cartoonist Brandon Graham is also currently writing Prophet (http://www.imagecomics.com/comics/4954/Prophet-Vol-1-Remission), a revival of an old Rob Liefield (yep) comic in a weird-creepy-cool post-acopalyptic sci-fi series that stands alone and requires no prior knowledge of the character.
Both of these are great.
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Image is on quite the hot streak now that creators are finally comprehending the slave/master relationship that is working with DC and Marvel.
Fatale, Saga, Prophet, Manhattan Projects have all been recent Image kick ass stuff.
I liked the first issue of Happy and I'm usually a little wary of Grant Morrison.
Anyone read Peter Panzerfaust? The premise and art are intriguing.
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Fatale, Saga, Prophet, Manhattan Projects have all been recent Image kick ass stuff.
I agree with all of these. Really great. I also like Peter Panzerfaust. Not as great as the others but I haven't stopped reading it.
Fraction's Hawkeye is wonderful. Not to be missed really.
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Fatale, Saga, Prophet, Manhattan Projects have all been recent Image kick ass stuff.
I agree with all of these. Really great. I also like Peter Panzerfaust. Not as great as the others but I haven't stopped reading it.
Fraction's Hawkeye is wonderful. Not to be missed really.
Yeah I've been meaning to pick up his Hawkeye. Matt Fraction seems like such a wonderful dude and I really enjoy certain heros from the Marvel universe but if it's possible, the Marvel line is essentially a brick wall for newcomers. I like the X-Men and Spider-man. Which of the ten titles for each of those characters do i pick? So confusing.
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Fatale, Saga, Prophet, Manhattan Projects have all been recent Image kick ass stuff.
I agree with all of these. Really great. I also like Peter Panzerfaust. Not as great as the others but I haven't stopped reading it.
Fraction's Hawkeye is wonderful. Not to be missed really.
Yeah I've been meaning to pick up his Hawkeye. Matt Fraction seems like such a wonderful dude and I really enjoy certain heros from the Marvel universe but if it's possible, the Marvel line is essentially a brick wall for newcomers. I like the X-Men and Spider-man. Which of the ten titles for each of those characters do i pick? So confusing.
I do not read too many super hero comics, really. Mostly dumb battles after dumb battles mixed in with a dumb crossover to sell more books. They are just not for me. However, I do love the way Fraction continually humanizes his superheros. He did it well with Invincible Ironman and is doing a superb job in the first two issues of Hawkeye. I would bet him an Aja will win Eisners for it next year.
A couple others I am enjoying: Brian Wood's THE MASSIVE, Matt Kindt's MIND MGMT. Top Shelf is having an incredible sale and I picked up 5 new books including UNDERWATER WELDER, BLANKETS (hardcover), LOST DOGS, WIZZYWIG. The sale is going on through tomorrow and there are some good deals. (http://www.topshelfcomix.com/catalog/special-deals (http://www.topshelfcomix.com/catalog/special-deals))
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Looks like The Best Show is going to make it into another comic: (https://twitter.com/zdarsky/status/401402831527112704)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BZIRv6GCcAAVD2X.png)
Loks like it is from Fraction & Zdarsky's SEX CRIMINALS.
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God, Sex Criminals is so good. And our man Matt Fraction rules even harder after seeing what the 4th printing cover for #1 looks like (sorry for the large image!):
(https://www.imagecomics.com/uploads/news/images/sexcrim1-4thprint-cov.jpg)